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Author Topic: What Happens if you are Not a KJB only?  (Read 10228 times)

judykanova

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Re: What Happens if you are Not a KJB only?
« Reply #15 on: November 06, 2004, 02:39:49 AM »
Hi Judy, there is much that you said I agree with. However, you also closed with this:
"Lastly and in conclusion,  when it comes to translations, the issue is not one of perfection (which can only be said of the original texts),  but one of relative faithfulness.  Like Christ_Alone, my preference is the KJV for reasons of overall faithfulness.   However, I am not going to lie and say I have never found other translations helpful.  I have invested in a parallel Bible which has about 6 translations (with KJV being the first) side-by-side for comparison.  As someone else mentioned in one of these 2 related threads,  such comparisons can be useful in our understanding of Scripture."

Judy, there is no such thing as "the originals", so how do you know what "relative faithfulness" is? God's true words are perfect - "the law of the LORD is perfect, converting the soul" Ps. 19.

The bogus bibles like the nasb, nkjv, niv, rsv, esv etc. all have proveable errors and are each one translated from different texts in both the O.T. and the N. T. Not one of them agrees with the others 100%. I have a multitude of examples of the Bible Babel that exists if you think all these versions are equally the words of God.

Are you admitting that you do not believe any Bible or any single text is the preserved, inerrant words of God? I think this is what you really believe, so why don't you just come out and say it?

Don't be afraid to admit what you really believe. More and more Christians are now openly taking this view - "There is no inspired, inerrant, complete, totally accurate Bible on the earth today, nor has there ever been one." At least in this way we will know where the other person is coming from.

Will Kinney,

I think you undersood perfectly what I referred to, when I said 'original manuscripts', even though I more accurately should have said the oldest available manuscripts.  So don't waste everyone's time playing this type of game.

So then, using a bit of common sense, ALL of our English Bibles -- including the KJV -- are translations.  And even the translators of the KJV made a few errors (although you choose to ignore this fact).  I'm sure God had a hand it their endeavor, to the extent that the KJ translators approached this monumental task in the manner of the honorable Bereans of old.  But they were not the men God is referring to when He said...

2Pe 1:20-21
20  Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.
21  For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.


A translation is itself an interpretation of sorts … interpreting the Hebrew or Greek word or phrase, to the most accurate, comparable English word or phrase.  Furthermore, even though I prefer the KJV for its overall accuracy, I also recognize that most of God's truths are spiritual in nature, and that it's GOD who opens the eyes of the blind to His truths.  Therefore, even if one were to agree with you... that the KJV is totally, 100% devoid of errors in translation, that would not bring anyone any closer to understanding or being transformed by God’s Word unless GOD prepares the 'soil' of their hearts to receive it.

Mat 13:13-16
13 Therefore speak I to them in parables: because they seeing see not; and hearing they hear not, neither do they understand.
14  And in them is fulfilled the prophecy of Esaias, which saith, By hearing ye shall hear, and shall not understand; and seeing ye shall see, and shall not perceive:
15  For this people's heart is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.
16  But blessed are your eyes, for they see: and your ears, for they hear.

Eze 36:26-27
26  A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.
27  And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them
.

Consider this…  how did God save His elect BEFORE the Bible was completed?

As to your attempt to twist this around with the ridiculous question of...
     "Are you admitting that you do not believe any Bible or any single text
     is the preserved, inerrant words of God? I think this is what you really
     believe, so why don't you just come out and say it?”
Let me just say that I have said exactly what I mean, and don’t appreciate your trying to put words in my mouth, which reflect your own distortions and biases.  You don’t need to concern yourself with others’ Bible preferences; that’s not your job!
And as you appear to be so preoccupied with a particular version of the Bible, you would do well to ask yourself these questions…
Who do you worship--  the Lord God our Creator, or a particular version of the Bible? 
Upon whom/what does your faith rest?  Does your faith rest upon the faith of Christ, or upon the accuracy of Bible translators?

1Co 4:20  
For the kingdom of God is not in word, but in power.

1Th 1:5 
For our gospel came not unto you in word only, but also in power[/u], and in the Holy Ghost[/b][/u], and in much assurance; as ye know what manner of men we were among you for your sake.



judy
'For ever, O LORD, thy word is settled in heaven.'   Ps 119:89

brandplucked

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Re: What Happens if you are Not a KJB only?
« Reply #16 on: November 06, 2004, 10:05:51 PM »
Hi Judy, you posted: "And as you appear to be so preoccupied with a particular version of the Bible, you would do well to ask yourself these questions…
Who do you worship--  the Lord God our Creator, or a particular version of the Bible? 
Upon whom/what does your faith rest?  Does your faith rest upon the faith of Christ, or upon the accuracy of Bible translators?"

Judy, you left something out.  My faith rests on the God who wrote the Bible and who promised to preserve His words.  All you see are "translators".  You are a practical humanist in the way you view scripture.  We know nothing about Christ and His redemptive work except from what we have revealed to us in the Bible, therefore the Bible itself is of utmost importance.  It is clear that you do not believe there exists such a thing as the inerrant words of God in any Book on this earth.  You avoided coming out and saying what you believe about this issue.

If you do believe there is an inerrant Book that is all the words of God, then what is it called and where do you think we can get a copy of it?   cricket....cricket...cricket


I'm just trying to make it obvious where all you guys are coming from on the Bible issue - you don't believe any inerrant, complete, inspired Bible exists on this earth.  Wake up saints.


Will Kinney

judykanova

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Re: What Happens if you are Not a KJB only?
« Reply #17 on: November 06, 2004, 10:52:39 PM »
Hi Judy, you posted: "And as you appear to be so preoccupied with a particular version of the Bible, you would do well to ask yourself these questions…
Who do you worship--  the Lord God our Creator, or a particular version of the Bible? 
Upon whom/what does your faith rest?  Does your faith rest upon the faith of Christ, or upon the accuracy of Bible translators?"

Judy, you left something out. My faith rests on the God who wrote the Bible and who promised to preserve His words. All you see are "translators". You are a practical humanist in the way you view scripture. We know nothing about Christ and His redemptive work except from what we have revealed to us in the Bible, therefore the Bible itself is of utmost importance. It is clear that you do not believe there exists such a thing as the inerrant words of God in any Book on this earth. You avoided coming out and saying what you believe about this issue.

If you do believe there is an inerrant Book that is all the words of God, then what is it called and where do you think we can get a copy of it? cricket....cricket...cricket


I'm just trying to make it obvious where all you guys are coming from on the Bible issue - you don't believe any inerrant, complete, inspired Bible exists on this earth. Wake up saints.


Will Kinney

Will Kinney,

Please don't presume to put words in my mouth.  I love God and His Holy Word - The Bible.  Notice I did not qualify this with 'the King James Only' Bible.

It doesn't matter to you that I prefer the King James, yet am not blind to the fact that some errors in translation were made.
As I said before, the translators were not the men of old who spoke as the Holy Spirit moved them. 

The fact that the KJV has some errors in translation, does not detract from the Bible as a whole nor its overall message, for the truth is still there and can be found by 'searching it out' as we are commanded to do.  The bottom line is this....  God's truths are largely spiritually discerned to begin with, and require eyes that are opened, a readiness of mind and spirit which only the Lord can give.

You, on the other hand, seem to have placed yourself in the position of allowing your faith to stand or fall on a perfect translation.  That is not a good position to be in.

There is really no point in debating this with you, as you have ignored the bulk of my post and the Scriptures given, and your primary method of defense is to put words in people's mouths , and close your ears to anything they have to say, short of agreement that the KJV is 100% free of errors in translation.

judy
'For ever, O LORD, thy word is settled in heaven.'   Ps 119:89

Genrev

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Re: What Happens if you are Not a KJB only?
« Reply #18 on: November 06, 2004, 11:07:00 PM »
 

The fact that the KJV has some errors in translation, does not detract from the Bible as a whole nor its overall message, for the truth is still there and can be found by 'searching it out' as we are commanded to do.  The bottom line is this....  God's truths are largely spiritually discerned to begin with, and require eyes that are opened, a readiness of mind and spirit which only the Lord can give.



Dear Judy,

I still don't get it.  If there are errors in the King James Bible, how are we to know where the errors are?  Is there a list somewhere online that gives the errors with chapters and verses that we can go by? 

(I am not trying to be antagonistic here...I just really don't understand this.)

Blessings,
Minna

brandplucked

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Re: What Happens if you are Not a KJB only?
« Reply #19 on: November 07, 2004, 02:20:03 PM »

Dear Judy,
I still don't get it.  If there are errors in the King James Bible, how are we to know where the errors are?  Is there a list somewhere online that gives the errors with chapters and verses that we can go by? 

Minna


Hi Minna, again, another good question.  When Christians like Judy tell us there are errors in the King James Bible, I have found by studing the Book that all they are doing is setting up their own minds as the Final Authority.  They usually speak out of ignorance.  I have been dealing with alleged errors in the KJB for several years now and have never seen one legitimate and proveable error in the King James Bible.  Never, not one.  If Judy has one proveable error, either textual or theological, then I would ask her to produce it for us.

Usually Bible critics will come up with some example of the translation of a particular word that they don't personally agree with and then claim it is wrong or an error.  Yet, inevitably there will be many other translators or "scholars" that will agree with the KJB reading.

Judy and others like her who are only KJV preferred but who do not believe ANY BIBLE on this earth is the preserved, inerrant words of God, rely on their personal opinions and ultimately set themselves up as the Final Authority for what God REALLY said.

Judy may give us a list of a few alleged errors, but then someone else will come up with their own differing list and disagree with Judy.  It is a shell game with these unbelievers.


If Judy is willing to do so, then let her post just one example of what she personally thinks is an error in the King James Bible.  Then you will see how their little game is played.

Thank you Minna for your interest in this most vital issue.  Has God kept His promises to preserve His inerrant words on this earth till heaven and earth pass away, or not?  That is the big question.  Did God lie or tell the truth about this?


Judy cannot tell you where to find any Bible that is the perfect, complete, inerrant words of God, because she and others like her do not believe such a thing exists.

But God says: "Seek ye out of THE BOOK of the LORD, AND READ"  - Isaiah 34:16

God also says: "As for me, this is my covenant with them, saith the LORD; My spirit that is upon thee, and my words which I have put in thy mouth, shall not depart out of thy mouth, nor out of the mouth of thy seed, nor out of the mouth of thy seed's seed, saith the LORD, from henceforth and for ever."  Isaiah 59:21

Think about what God is saying in this verse.  The implications are huge.

God bless,

Will Kinney

 


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