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Author Topic: Why is Babylon the Great called a Mystery?  (Read 436 times)

Roger Dodson

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Why is Babylon the Great called a Mystery?
« on: December 27, 2017, 12:00:36 PM »

Why is Babylon the Great called a Mystery?

Maurice

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Re: Why is Babylon the Great called a Mystery?
« Reply #1 on: December 27, 2017, 03:29:11 PM »
Because 100 Christians have 100 different ideas of what it means.  The truth is a mystery.


Drew

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Re: Why is Babylon the Great called a Mystery?
« Reply #2 on: December 28, 2017, 09:40:35 AM »
The fact that the whore of Babylon is referred to as a mystery means that we cannot be completely certain as to her identity. But the best teachers say she is Iraq.

Erik Diamond

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Re: Why is Babylon the Great called a Mystery?
« Reply #3 on: December 28, 2017, 04:26:24 PM »
Quote
The fact that the whore of Babylon is referred to as a mystery means that we cannot be completely certain as to her identity. But the best teachers say she is Iraq.

No, Babylon is a mystery or secret to all except those whom Christ has given to know spiritual things.  There are not many people who will actually recognize the woman for who she is. Without the Spirit, Babylon will remain a mystery/secret to them. They will come up with many theories that Babylon the Great is Rome, Iraq, Jerusalem, Papal System, etc. because they have carnal minds.


A few of us here believe that Babylon is a unfaithful congregation of Israel, the external Covenant Church where the abomination of desolation be set up.
 
"For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the LORD. For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts." (Isaiah 55:8-9)

Tony Warren

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Re: Why is Babylon the Great called a Mystery?
« Reply #4 on: December 30, 2017, 01:55:49 PM »
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Why is Babylon the Great called a Mystery?
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Mystery: [musterion], from muo (shut mouth),
 by extension a secret; that upspoken (unknown);
 a mystery  (through, no explanation), a silence
 of revelation; an enigma or puzzle.

Why is Babylon the Great called a Mystery in Scripture? For the very same reason the Kingdom of God is called a mystery:

Mark 4:11
  • "And he said unto them, Unto you it is given to know the mystery of the kingdom of God: but unto them that are without, all these things are done in parables:"

A mystery because to most of the world it is unrevealed, a secret that they cannot get their minds around. It's a mystery for the very same reason that Scripture calls the revelation of Salvation going to the Gentiles as well as the Jews a mystery.

Romans 11:25
  • "For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in."

Does Israel think it is blind? Of course not, because it is a mystery (secret) to them. Likewise they never understood that Old Testament Scriptures prophesied deliverance to the Gentiles, who would be included in the New Covenant with Israel. It was a mystery. Again, for the very same reason that the Scriptures call the transformation of believers from one state to another a mystery.

1st Corinthians 15:51
  • "Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,"

The secret of our end of the flesh when Christ returns revealed to the saints, but still a mystery to those in unbelief. And for the same reason the Scriptures call the marriage between Christ and the church a mystery.

Ephesians 5:32
  • "This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church."

It is a mystery because it is not understood by most, it is hidden (a secret) because of the power of darkness that hangs over their eyes. How could Christ be espoused to a body of believers, when He is their God. Man calls it foolishness, but the saints understand by the wisdom of Christ the Spiritual nature of His headship and life-long binding together with them.

Why do we think the Scriptures speak of the mystery of iniquity that was even in Paul's time in the church, and how it was being restrained by the Holy Spirit until it be taken out of the midst? This is a mystery because to most, that idea is unpalatable. Restrained for what, and loosed for what? This mystery is hid from their eyes because they don't really understand the specific reason that Satan was bound in the first place. i.e., so that he could not deceive the nations until after the millemnnial reign and witness of the saints (Revelation 20) was accomplished. What then? God tells us Satan must be loosed. That iniquity that was restrained by Christ's cross is a mystery to many because they really don't understand why Satan was bound. Many accept that he was bound, but they don't :"really" know why. Just as the time of Satan's losing when iniquity will again abound in the congregation is a mystery.

Just like Israel before it, the church just can't bring itself to believe that the man of sin could take a seat (rule) in God's holy habitation. But when He that restrains iniquity is taken out of the way (midst), that is exactly what will happen. 

2nd Thessalonians 2:6-7
  • "And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time.
  • For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way."

That word "letteth" is an old English word that means restraineth. So it was a mystery that iniquity was in the church even then, but was being restrained, and would be restrained until He that restrains iniquity (the Spirit of God) was taken out of the midst. That word translated "way" actually means midst or middle. This is a mystery because so many unfaithful do not know, cannot understand, will not believe and are spiritually blind to what God has not revealed to them. Which is, the mystery that the church will become spiritually as Babylon the great when He that restrains iniquity is taken out of the midst. Babylon, that harlot that leaves her espoused for the pleasures of sinful man ruling in His stead. The mystery is that this harlot is the unfaithful church, decked out so beautifully on the outside, but within an abomination that will leave her desolate. A secret to those who remain within, in unbelief, even though they continue to call themselves by the name of the Lord.


"nosce te ipsum"
 
Peace,
Tony Warren
"I acknowledged my sin unto thee, and mine iniquity have I not hid. I said, I will confess my transgressions unto the Lord; and thou forgavest the iniquity of my sin. Selah. -Psalms 32:5"

Maurice

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Re: Why is Babylon the Great called a Mystery?
« Reply #5 on: December 30, 2017, 04:39:44 PM »
So why do the best teachers (according to Drew) say it is Iraq? And why does someone else say it is some other thing or place?

Red

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Re: Why is Babylon the Great called a Mystery?
« Reply #6 on: December 30, 2017, 04:43:32 PM »
Mystery: [musterion], from muo (shut mouth), by extension a secret; that upspoken (unknown); a mystery  (through, no explanation), a silence of revelation; an enigma or puzzle.

Why is Babylon the Great called a Mystery in Scripture?

Why do we think the Scriptures speak of the mystery of iniquity that was even in Paul's time in the church, and how it was being restrained by the Holy Spirit until it be taken out of the midst? This is a mystery because to most, that idea is unpalatable. Restrained for what, and loosed for what? This mystery is hid from their eyes because they don't really understand the specific reason that Satan was bound in the first place. i.e., so that he could not deceive the nations until after the millemnnial reign and witness of the saints (Revelation 20) was accomplished. What then? God tells us Satan must be loosed. That iniquity that was restrained by Christ's cross is a mystery to many because they really don't understand why Satan was bound. Many accept that he was bound, but they don't :"really" know why. Just as the time of Satan's losing when iniquity will again abound in the congregation is a mystery.

Just like Israel before it, the church just can't bring itself to believe that the man of sin could take a seat (rule) in God's holy habitation. But when He that restrains iniquity is taken out of the way (midst), that is exactly what will happen. 

2nd Thessalonians 2:6-7
  • "And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time.
  • For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way."

That word "letteth" is an old English word that means restraineth. So it was a mystery that iniquity was in the church even then, but was being restrained, and would be restrained until He that restrains iniquity (the Spirit of God) was taken out of the midst. That word translated "way" actually means midst or middle. This is a mystery because so many unfaithful do not know, cannot understand, will not believe and are spiritually blind to what God has not revealed to them. Which is, the mystery that the church will become spiritually as Babylon the great when He that restrains iniquity is taken out of the midst. Babylon, that harlot that leaves her espoused for the pleasures of sinful man ruling in His stead. The mystery is that this harlot is the unfaithful church, decked out so beautifully on the outside, but within an abomination that will leave her desolate. A secret to those who remain within, in unbelief, even though they continue to call themselves by the name of the Lord.[/size]
All of God's children said~AMEN, and AMEN.
"And he shewed me a pure river of water, clear as crystal, proceeding out of the throne of God and of the Lamb."~Revelation 22:1

In the world to come~there WILL BE "pure pleasures"~river/tree=all that is needed to sustain us Forever! Joy, peace, contentment in its fullest, etc.

Red

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Re: Why is Babylon the Great called a Mystery?
« Reply #7 on: December 30, 2017, 04:51:24 PM »
So why do the best teachers (according to Drew) say it is Iraq? And why does someone else say it is some other thing or place?
Did you read Mr. Warren's post carefully?
Quote from: Tony Warren
A mystery because to most of the world it is unrevealed, a secret that they cannot get their minds around.
The best teachers in the eyes of the world~NOT according to whom the Spirit calls faithful men, these men are hated and rejected by most just as their Lord before them.
"And he shewed me a pure river of water, clear as crystal, proceeding out of the throne of God and of the Lamb."~Revelation 22:1

In the world to come~there WILL BE "pure pleasures"~river/tree=all that is needed to sustain us Forever! Joy, peace, contentment in its fullest, etc.

Reformer

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Re: Why is Babylon the Great called a Mystery?
« Reply #8 on: December 30, 2017, 07:03:28 PM »
So why do the best teachers (according to Drew) say it is Iraq? And why does someone else say it is some other thing or place?

Did you even read Tony's post? It sure doesn't seem so by your response because that was addressed. People who are earthly minded (like most evangelicals and Dispensationalists) say it's Iraq because Iraq is where Babylon was situated long ago. These people cannot take their minds off of physical Kingdoms, governments, leaders, Israel, Iraq, political parties, etc., and so they think just like the world they are a part of thinks. So Drew says it's Iraq and then someone else says it's some other thing or place. So what! Is that what the Bible says? As Tony said, it remains a mystery to them because they are not spiritually minded.

Ro 8:6 For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.

1Co 2:14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

 Just as Christ being the Messiah remains a mystery to national Israel because they are not spiritually minded.  Some Reformers think Babylon is Rome, and some others claim she is the world system and still some others argue that she is America or whatever nation is last being responsible for any destruction in Israel. The point is yes, it's a mystery to all who don't get their interpretations from the Bible. So what if Drew says it's Iraq, so what someone else says it's the Vatican, the Amorites, Islam or the imperialists. People say ignorant and untrue things all the time because they are blind or uninformed. Trump says Obama taped his conversations, was not born in the US and his own inauguration was the best attended of all. The reason is because he's ignorant and uninformed so the truth is actually a mystery to him. You get the point? People say things that are untrue because of ignorance or being uninformed all the time. The truth is a mystery to people because they don't want the truth, they want justification of what they already believe. And God blinds them further because of that. I suggest you reread Tony Warren's reply again with an open mind this time. See if it's still a mystery that all don't receive the truth.

ZeroCool

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Re: Why is Babylon the Great called a Mystery?
« Reply #9 on: December 30, 2017, 08:41:17 PM »
 &TY All.     It's all very enlightening.

 


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