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Author Topic: Where Did Old Testament Believers Go When They Died?  (Read 27103 times)

Halle

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Re: Where Did Old Testament Believers Go When They Died?
« Reply #105 on: July 24, 2008, 11:08:55 AM »

  Thanks Reformer. I gotta remember that.

andreas

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Re: Where Did Old Testament Believers Go When They Died?
« Reply #106 on: July 24, 2008, 05:26:51 PM »
Yea,paradise is where the throne of God is.

7 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the tree of life, which is in the midst of the paradise of God.Revelation 2.

If we look at the end of the book of Revelation we find that the tree of life is in the heavenly city of God.

1 And he shewed me a pure river of water of life, clear as crystal, proceeding out of the throne of God and of the Lamb.
2 In the midst of the street of it, and on either side of the river, was there the tree of life, which bare twelve manner of fruits, and yielded her fruit every month: and the leaves of the tree were for the healing of the nations.Revelation 22.

Christ's  promise of the fruit of life is made to him who overcomes .The right to eat of the fruit  is secured only through obedience.

19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.Romans 5.

andreas.
kai ean diabainhs dią udatos meta sou eimi kai potamoi ou sugklusousin se kai ean dielqhs dia puros ou mh katakauqhs flox ou katakausei Isaiah 43:2

Melanie

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Re: Where Did Old Testament Believers Go When They Died?
« Reply #107 on: May 31, 2010, 02:00:35 PM »
I don't know about you but when I sleep, I'm not conscious, yet I'm present with the Lord.

 You are missing the point. Tony didn't say that, God did. So why are you arguing that point? It makes no sense.  You have to be honest at least.


 "Therefore we are always confident, knowing that, whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the Lord: "
-Second Corinthians chapter 5 verse 6

 What I don't understand is why so many people insist upon arguing with what scripture says.  I could understand if someone was saying, this is what it means, but he's only quoting scripture. Clearly in some sense we are absent from the Lord when present in this body. It is absurd to deny this. So why are you doing it?


Quote
Yes, Moses and Elijah were awakened at the transfiguration but I would think they are resting just fine at this moment, sleeping like a baby. 

What about the word of God? What do you do with God's word?

 "We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord. "
  -Second Corinthians chapter 5 verse 8

  How is he in limbo sleep if he is absent from the body and present with the Lord?  Do you believe scripture to be inerrant?


Quote
There just seems to be far to many scriptures that show saints sleeping until resurrection day to say that saints go to heaven immediately when they die.   
Raybob

  Where are they Raybob?  One at a time please, don't bombard me with them. What one scripture can you give me that says saints sleep until resurrection day?



Kenneth White

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Re: Where Did Old Testament Believers Go When They Died?
« Reply #108 on: May 31, 2010, 08:47:02 PM »
I don't know about you but when I sleep, I'm not conscious, yet I'm present with the Lord.

 You are missing the point. Tony didn't say that, God did. So why are you arguing that point? It makes no sense.  You have to be honest at least.


Melanie,
  Let me see if I can explain why, because this tactic has been used often here. He is arguing the point because he doesn't like that God said "being present with the Lord is being absent from the body." Therefore, he answers every post as if Tony is the one who said it, and then he can say that it is not true. That way, he isn't accused of denying God's word. It is not a new tactic, but I do understand your frustration with people who choose to act in that manner.

This is no different than other Christians who ignore Scripture. God's word is sharp! It cuts! It digs deep within us! It shows us just how wretched we truly are. Those willing to be cut by it are healed. those who defend against it are slain. Instead of fighting against God's word, we need to embrace it as a means of deliverance from our sins. Not as a means of escaping from the truth. And some people just won't. We just have to face those facts.

Now for the Topic:
From "REFORMED ANSWERS"

Question
When Moses died, where did he go, since Jesus Christ had not yet come?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Answer
When Old Testament believers (such as Moses) died, they went to heaven even though Jesus had not yet come. Before the foundation of the world, the Father had covenanted with the Son that the Son would die for the sins of believers. Therefore, the forgiveness Christ purchased by his death was certain. Because it was certain, it was available to Old Testament believers.

One reason we know this is true is that even in the Old Testament God forgave people's sins (e.g. Exod. 34:7; Lev. 4:20,26,31,35; 5:10,13,16,18; 6:7; 19:22; Num. 14:19; 15:25,26,28; Deut. 21:8 ). As we learn in Hebrews 9-10 (e.g. 10:11; etc.), the sacrifices in the Old Testament did not themselves provide forgiveness. Rather, they pointed to the sacrifice that Christ would offer. Thus, the forgiveness received in the Old Testament was based on Christ's atonement. Even though he had not yet come, the fact that he had covenanted to come was sufficient to merit salvation "on credit," so to speak.

Another reason we know that Old Testament saints went to heaven is that we have examples of this, such as Elijah (2 Kings 2:11).

Answer by Ra McLaughlin



Proverbs 1:5-6 "A wise man will hear, and will increase learning; and a man of understanding shall attain unto wise counsels: To understand a proverb, and the interpretation; the words of the wise, and their dark sayings."

Della

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Re: Where Did Old Testament Believers Go When They Died?
« Reply #109 on: June 01, 2010, 12:07:51 PM »
  I was always taught that the dead in Christ shall rise first. And this meant that if you were saved, you're always in Christ whether you're alive or dead. So when we die, our bodies go into the grave, but it is still the personal possession of Christ and so He would reclaim it from its decomposed dust at the last day (Romans 8 "neither death nor life nor anything else shall be able to separate us from the love of God which is in Christ Jesus." So this is something new to me. But if you all are right, then who are the dead in Christ that shall rise?

 1Thess 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:

Why are they rising if they are not in the grave? Thanks.

Shirley

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Re: Where Did Old Testament Believers Go When They Died?
« Reply #110 on: June 08, 2010, 02:02:07 PM »
  I was always taught that the dead in Christ shall rise first.

Why are they rising if they are not in the grave? Thanks.


I have been taught this also. So I also am puzzled as to this.

 1 Thessalonians 4:16
  "For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:"

The dead in Christ shall rise first. Since they are in heaven, it means their bodies will rise from the grave first, and then they will receive spiritual bodies.


Kira

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Re: Where Did Old Testament Believers Go When They Died?
« Reply #111 on: June 09, 2010, 04:50:13 PM »
  I was always taught that the dead in Christ shall rise first.

Why are they rising if they are not in the grave? Thanks.


I have been taught this also. So I also am puzzled as to this.



  They are rising from the dead.

 2 Cor.  5:8 "We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord."

The Dead in Christ are those who are absent from the body and present with the Lord. They are not resurrected bodies.



K I R A 

George

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Re: Where Did Old Testament Believers Go When They Died?
« Reply #112 on: June 09, 2010, 05:04:48 PM »

 They are not resurrected bodies.



 Then how are they rising from the dead?   >:(

Tony Warren

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Re: Where Did Old Testament Believers Go When They Died?
« Reply #113 on: June 09, 2010, 06:19:52 PM »
>>>
I was always taught that the dead in Christ shall rise first.
<<<

And they shall. But not as some people understand the phrase Humanistically, but as God intended it to mean those who have died will be raised up again. Not literally corpses coming out of graves caves or out of the dirt in the ground, but God is simply saying, the dead shall rise again. He is speaking in the vernacular of man. ...as He has always done! ie, Elijah would come, God repents of what He had done, the lamb slain from the foundation of the world, the 10 kings that would rise, the rising of the Beast from the sea, etc. No beast is going to very literally rise from the sea, but God is explaining a rise of evil in the vernacular of a devouring beast, so that man can understand its nature. Likewise, the dead in Christ have already risen in the First Resurrection, so they will not "very literally" rise again from the dead. They're not literally dead, they are in Christ (thus never die) and from man's earthly/humanistic perspective, have died.

John 11:25-26
  • "Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live:
  • And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?"

Thus, those who have died (in man's way of thinking) very literally never really died. And Christ will bring them with Him when He returns. We know they never died. but from man's perspective, they died, and at the last day will be risen from the grave again.

I confess, what you've learned about dead literal bodies being raised, is widely believed. Even by many really sound Christians. Because there are difficult passages for many people to reconcile with the rest of scripture. The truth is, first, the dead will rise from the dead, because from man's perspective they were put in the grave and they are dead. So it's not a contradiction.

Philippians 1:21
  • "For to me to live is Christ, and to die is gain."

What? Paul can never die. But the word is written this way because from our human perspective, when Paul ceases to be in the body of flesh, He has died. But from the true perspective, God's perspective, which is the Kingdom perspective of eternal life, He never died (John 11:26).

Likewise, the dead in Christ lived and they believed in Christ, so they could never have actually died. So is this a unsolvable dichotomy? Not really. Because the Bible is written by an all understanding God, to fallible men who see through a glass darkly. And so from man's perspective, they died and were buried down in a grave. Thus seeing them come back again is spoken of as them "rising from the dead." Even though from the "true" and Spiritual sense, they most certainly have never died, and have never been dead down in the grave, but living and reigning with Christ in the paradise of heaven. Thus the language, the dead in Christ shall first rise, simply illustrates those Christians who died (from man's perspective), and shall rise up to life again. The people who have died (humanistically speaking, died) as Christians, shall the people on earth see as risen with Christ. And the Christians living on earth observing this shall be caught up in the air to join them. Those who sleep (died) in Jesus, will God bring with him, because they live and reign with Him in heaven. They can't come with Him if they are not with Him. Selah.

As I always encourage, we have to consider not just a "sentence or word" in scripture, but the whole context, in context, and in harmony with the "REST" of the Bible. Else we will always have confusion and erroneous suppositions. Because the Christian dead (them that sleep) are absolutely with Christ, not in the bodies in the grave. Are we to suppose that the saints will be put back in their dead bodies on the last day just to be raised to to be with Christ in the air? The whole idea is disjointed and inconsistent. the facts are, to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord. And to be present in our body (in the ground or otherwise) is to be absent from the Lord. God told us, when the Apostle Paul would leave his body in death, he would be present with the Lord. Thus he is absent from the body of death. So, the passage in question becomes clear in context:

1st Thessalonians 4:13
  • "But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope."

We need not worry about Christians who sleep or have died (humanistically speaking), because the Christian hope is eternal life after death, not a mystic limbo state in a grave on earth. God's promise is sure to His people, and it is only the unsaved that have no hope of life never ceasing.

1st Thessalonians 4:14
  • "For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him."

The dead in Christ are with Christ (2nd Corinthians 5:8 ), and as He died and rose again, so those In Christ had part in that same FIRST Resurrection, and thus will Christ bring with Him when He comes. They live with Him and that is why He can bring them with Him. They are not in bodies in the grave, they are not in rotting corpses, they are not waiting there to be resurrected a second time. Only "THE REST OF THE DEAD" are. Resurrected from death to stand before God and be judged. Christ can't possibly bring the saints with him (unless He is also in the ground), if they are not with Him in heaven in the FIRST place.

1st Thessalonians 4:15
  • "For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep."

God explains that Christians that are alive on the earth on the last day, when Christ returns on the clouds of glory, will not be those who will precede those Christians who have already died (are asleep). The word translated prevent is the Greek [phthano], meaning before, and by extension, to precede. We're not going to be first, the first are those dead whom Christ will bring with Him. They have the prominent position of the Dead who are with Christ First. These are those whom Christ shall bring with Him with the trump of God.

1st Thessalonians 4:16
  • "For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:"

The Kingdom is coming from heaven, not on earth (except those who remain alive on earth), and its true coming is personified in Christ, the Chief Messenger who descends from heaven with a shout. We on earth shall not precede the dead in Christ who we shall see rise first. From our (earthly) perspective, they are those risen from the dead.

1st Thessalonians 4:16
  • "Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord."

Then those of us who have not previously died, will be Raptured up to be with the Lord and the dead in Christ who He has brought with Him, and so shall we forever be with Him.

It's not a declaration that there are saints in the grave living in rotting corpses, that shall arise. Nor that the saints were in Limbo and then returned back with their corpses in order that they rise to meet the Lord. That is Ludicrous. Flesh and Blood cannot inherit the Kingdom, therefore why would a corpse be reconstituted for the Souls of the saints? It makes no sense. Likewise, those of us who remain on earth aren't going to be keeping our earthly bodies either, we will be changed instantly, proving there is absolutely no want or need for the earthly body whatsoever. So why would bodies in the ground rise up from the grave? No bodies are going to be rising up from the grave. The dead are rising only in the sense that people on earth see the dead in Christ coming back from the dead (in the human vernacular).

1st Corinthians 15:51-52
  • "Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
  • In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed."

The dead DO rise again (come back from the dead) incorruptible, and the living DO put off their earthly bodies ti "Join Them," instantly putting on that same incorruption. Because the mortal man must put on immortality. It has nothing to do with literally rising bodies from the literal graves, but those who have died rising again. many Christians don't even have a grave, they were burned into lime and scattered, eaten by fish so that there is nothing but wastes left. There is no point in reconstitution of corruptible bodies, just so they can be changed again instantly. Again, it makes no sense because it's not true. The Saints are not in the graves, nor will they be put there in order to rise. Neither they themselves, nor their bodies.

 
Quote
>>>
And this meant that if you were saved, you're always in Christ whether you're alive or dead.
<<<

Correct!


Quote
>>>
So when we die, our bodies go into the grave,
<<<

Correct!


Quote
>>>
...but it is still the personal possession of Christ
<<<

Actually, what would Christ want with a stinking rotting corpse that the Souyl is not even in? Our bodies go into the ground it is true, but then they decay and return to the dust from whence they came, just as scripture says. Corpses are not the personal possession of Christ, they are the chemicals of the earth, and are returned to the earth. But the souls are Spiritual, and they are nowhere near those stinking dirt corpses. They are absent from the body and live and reign with Christ.


Quote
>>>
...and so He would reclaim it from its decomposed dust at the last day
<<<

Decomposed body dust or even reconstituted decomposed bodies are not reclaimed by Christ at the last day, as these things are unclean and cannot inherit the Kingdom. Why would God put a clean soul back into an unclean body, just to change it?  Even those alive must get rid of their bodies instantly before joining Christ. Much less the dead souls given back their dead Corpses. Makes no sense. Think about it. Why would the Dead be given back their decayed corruptible bodies while the Living are having theirs taken away, when they both have the same destination and are the same souls of the First Resurrection?

Now the new incorruptible body, that's something altogether different. Its not raised because it was never dead.


Quote
>>>
 (Romans 8 "neither death nor life nor anything else shall be able to separate us from the love of God which is in Christ Jesus."
<<<

You will note that this verse does not say that Christ would reclaim bodies from their decomposed dust at the last day, as you are using it as proof of. Indeed, that scripture is 100% true. Nothing can separate us from the Love of Christ. Certainly not death, because in death, we don't "LIVE NOT AGAIN," we Continue to live and reign, but not on earth, in Heaven. How? Specifically because we have part in the First Resurrection.

Quote
>>>
So this is something new to me. But if you all are right, then who are the dead in Christ that shall rise?
<<<

Abraham, Moses, David, Luke, Peter, Paul, Stephen, John, etc. Them will Christ bring with Him.


Quote
>>>
 1Thess 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:

Why are they rising if they are not in the grave? Thanks.
<<<

Luke 5:23
  • "Whether is easier, to say, Thy sins be forgiven thee; or to say, Rise up and walk?"

What's the point? The point is, whether Christ said his sins were forgiven, or He said raise up from the dead, He was saying the exact same things. To he who has ears to hear it. Those whose sins were forgiven will rise up and they will be those Christ brings with them. But they have never been in the dirt, the corpses or the ground. They have been absent from the body and present with the Lord.
 
When God speaks of our spiritual death and resurrection, He speaks in terms of physical death and Spiritual resurrection. Which really have nothing whatsoever to do with physical bodies in the grave being reconstituted. ...when studied circumspectly. Likewise with the dead in Christ. Look how God speaks of the dead in Ezekiel.

Ezekiel 37:5-6
  • "Thus saith the Lord GOD unto these bones; Behold, I will cause breath to enter into you, and ye shall live:
  • And I will lay sinews upon you, and will bring up flesh upon you, and cover you with skin, and put breath in you, and ye shall live; and ye shall know that I am the LORD."

Again, the point being, I could protest all day that this word clearly speaks of a time when physical dead bodies will be reconstituted and breath breathed into them and they come to life, and I would be wrong all day long!!! It speaks not about bodies being raised, but about salvation.

The dead in Christ do rise. But as God defines it. Not as corpses that stand up from the grave. As those dead Christ brings with Him. And because we are on earth, and God speaks to us as men throughout time and understanding that they have been dead and buried, from our perspective, they have risen from the grave. Selah.

"nosce te ipsum"
 
Peace,
Tony Warren
"I acknowledged my sin unto thee, and mine iniquity have I not hid. I said, I will confess my transgressions unto the Lord; and thou forgavest the iniquity of my sin. Selah. -Psalms 32:5"

Tony Warren

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Re: Where Did Old Testament Believers Go When They Died?
« Reply #114 on: June 09, 2010, 06:43:16 PM »
>>>
 They are not resurrected bodies.

 Then how are they rising from the dead? 
<<<

The same way as how in order to be present with the Lord, we have to be absent from the body. It depends on how we understand the phrase. Because even though the Lord's presence is always with us, yet the statement is 100 percent absolutely true.

Likewise, when we understand where the dead in Christ are, and how Christ can bring them with Him, we understand how we who remain can say they rise from the dead. ...as "actually" they never died!  :-\


"nosce te ipsum"
 
Peace,
Tony Warren
"I acknowledged my sin unto thee, and mine iniquity have I not hid. I said, I will confess my transgressions unto the Lord; and thou forgavest the iniquity of my sin. Selah. -Psalms 32:5"

George

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Re: Where Did Old Testament Believers Go When They Died?
« Reply #115 on: June 10, 2010, 10:51:38 AM »


 I disagree!  :typing:

Herman Stowe

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Re: Where Did Old Testament Believers Go When They Died?
« Reply #116 on: June 10, 2010, 11:06:03 AM »

I was taught that this shows we have Jesus uniting the dead who are with Him with their bodies. I have to admit, I have often wondered why, but just brushed it off.

I see your point. Why raise their dead bodies and unite those with Christ with the bodies, and then give them glorified bodies. Yeah, that raises more questions than it is supposed to answer. It is very difficult to understand these passages.

Mark

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Re: Where Did Old Testament Believers Go When They Died?
« Reply #117 on: December 08, 2017, 03:13:23 AM »
Hi all,

I was reading this post the other day and this scripture came to mind.  I realise this thread is old so please forgive me, I would like to share it.

Matthew 22:32 (KJV)

31 But as touching the resurrection of the dead, have ye not read that which was spoken unto you by God, saying,
32 I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob? God is not the God of the dead, but of the LIVING.

God bless.

Mark

Rich Aikers

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Re: Where Did Old Testament Believers Go When They Died?
« Reply #118 on: December 08, 2017, 05:02:46 AM »
 :welcome: Mark!

Tony Warren

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Re: Where Did Old Testament Believers Go When They Died?
« Reply #119 on: December 08, 2017, 07:28:19 AM »
>>>
Hi all,
I was reading this post the other day and this scripture came to mind.  I realise this thread is old so please forgive me, I would like to share it.

Matthew 22:32 (KJV)
31 But as touching the resurrection of the dead, have ye not read that which was spoken unto you by God, saying,
32 I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob? God is not the God of the dead, but of the LIVING.

God bless.
Mark
<<<



Hi and  :welcome: 


No, we like old threads here as exegesis of Scriptures never gets old and new points always arise.

Matthew 22:31-32
  • "But as touching the resurrection of the dead, have ye not read that which was spoken unto you by God, saying, I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob? God is not the God of the dead, but of the living."

Good call. Yes, this agrees perfectly with what Christ has already told us. Many of that day (as did Martha and many in our day) thought that when they died, they were dead and in the ground, and at sometime in the future (at the last day), they would be raised up from the dead. They believed this was the first resurrection. But Christ is correcting such beliefs both here and with Martha in the book of John, in declaring that He was the resurrection, and those who believe in Him are not dead and never die. In accordance, that verse supports that Abraham, Isaac and Jacob are not dead as many believe, they live with their redeemer. Notice that language in the book of John where Christ said that whosoever was alive in the flesh and believed on Him would never die, and whosoever died in the flesh and believed on Him were yet alive. He is saying that their body is dead but in the Kingdom of heaven they still live. For those not having read this thread before, Martha had this same incorrect thinking concerning the resurrection.

John 11:24-26
  • "Martha saith unto him, I know that he shall rise again in the resurrection at the last day.
  • Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live:
  • And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?"

No one that truly believes ever dies. That is precisely why Christ says God is a God of the living, not the dead. Abraham was not dead, He was alive because He had part in the Spirit of Christ (1st Peter 1:10-11), the first resurrection. Martha was wrong, the resurrection in view was not at the last day, it is when we are spiritually raised up from death to life by faith of Christ Jesus, and in this state we are forever living and will never die. If we do die, then God was not our God, for He is not the God of the dead.

Ephesians 2:5-6
  • "Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved; )
  • And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:"

Christ is the resurrection in which all saints, Old and New, never die. Because to be absent from the flesh of the body is to be present in Spirit with the Lord. Both Old Testament believers who died in the flesh but had the Spirit of Christ, and New Testament believers who are absent in the flesh, go to live and reign with their Lord.

Colossians 5:7-8
  • " For we walk by faith, not by sight:
  • We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord."

That same Spirit of Christ is how thousands of years ago Job could say, "For I know that my redeemer liveth, and that he shall stand at the latter day upon the earth."  And though Job's body was eaten away by worms in the dirt of the earth, yet in his spiritual body he saw God. Just as Abraham saw Him.

John 8:56-57
  • "Your father Abraham rejoiced to see my day: and he saw it, and was glad.
  • Then said the Jews unto him, Thou art not yet fifty years old, and hast thou seen Abraham?"

He saw it by anticipation in His life and He saw it after he was absent from the body, because believers never die. Abraham was not dead, since as we've already read, God is not a God of the dead, thus Abraham yet lived. In fact, just by Christ saying that,

"as touching the resurrection of the dead, have ye not read that which was spoken unto you by God, saying, I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob? God is not the God of the dead, but of the living"

...has Christ confirming that Abraham, Isaac and Jacob were yet alive, and He is no God of the dead.  He was the Resurrection--Q.E.D. they lived by faith of Christ. They never really died because Christ was the Lamb of God slain from the foundation (Revelation 13:8) of the world. In other words, by faith in His efficacy of the prophesied cross, all their sins were paid for, and indeed were the sins of all the Old Testament saints. Did not Moses appear with Christ. How would that be possible if he were dead? Obviously he was not dead either. They, as we, were all saved by faith in this Redeemer. We looking backward in time to His finished work and they looking forward in time to it. All by the faith of Christ, which is counted for our righteousness.

The passage of Matthew 22:31-32 of Christ only being a God of the living, not the dead, confirms Old Testament Saints never died. ...unless of course He wasn't their God in the Old Testament times.

"nosce te ipsum"
 
Peace,
Tony Warren
"I acknowledged my sin unto thee, and mine iniquity have I not hid. I said, I will confess my transgressions unto the Lord; and thou forgavest the iniquity of my sin. Selah. -Psalms 32:5"

 


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