[ Home | Eschatology | Bible Studies | Classics | Articles | Sermons | Apologetics | Search | F.A.Q. ]

Author Topic: Christ as the fulfillment of all prophecy  (Read 5124 times)

Manuel

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 35
  • Obviously I'm a Novice
Re: Christ as the fulfillment of all prophecy
« Reply #30 on: April 29, 2019, 08:14:07 AM »
There are some people that you just can't reason with. Just like the Trump people. Cults are the same everywhere. They pick a side and they blindly follow the narrative of that side no matter if it is sound, true or even reasonable. That's what makes them adversaries of the truth. Their inability to accept it over their leaders narrative.

 )Goodpoint( The father of lies and his children are all of the same character.

"John 8:44-45 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it. And because I tell you the truth, ye believe me not."

There will always be the cult that belies lies and the believers of truth, and they will never be joined like some people think they are.







George

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 388
  • I'm a llama!
Re: Christ as the fulfillment of all prophecy
« Reply #31 on: April 29, 2019, 12:21:19 PM »
You know you guys make such good arguments.

Yeah, right!


Quote
I don't understand why people keep arguing the other side when it's so obvious that what you are saying is from scripture.

The Devil quotes scripture to. That means nothing.


Quote
I don't know where this reign of Christ on earth came from.

It came from the Bible. This spiritualizing is fake News, not the good news to Israel. It's replacement theology.


George

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 388
  • I'm a llama!
Re: Christ as the fulfillment of all prophecy
« Reply #32 on: April 29, 2019, 02:24:45 PM »
Those of faith, are the true children of God~God's promises are BY GRACE, not because of blood that flows through man's sinful veins.

Then why did God say the Jews were his chosen people? Why didn't he say the gentiles were? Because the Jews are very special people.

Melanie

  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 876
  • Gender: Female
  • 🌴"But I am like a green olive tree in the house of God. -Psalm 52:8"
Re: Christ as the fulfillment of all prophecy
« Reply #33 on: April 30, 2019, 01:14:27 AM »
Those of faith, are the true children of God~God's promises are BY GRACE, not because of blood that flows through man's sinful veins.

Then why did God say the Jews were his chosen people? Why didn't he say the gentiles were?

He did.


Quote
Because the Jews are very special people.

They are.

"For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh: But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God. Romans 2:28-29"


I just wish you guys (and girls) would start actually listening to scripture and not political propaganda.


Robert Powell

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 215
  • Gender: Male
  • "fruit of the righteous, a tree of Life" Pr 11:30
Re: Christ as the fulfillment of all prophecy
« Reply #34 on: April 30, 2019, 03:31:33 AM »
 )Goodpoint(  A point that has been made again and again with these Dispensationalists, but it falls on deaf ears.

Red

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 297
  • Gender: Male
  • Galatians 2:16
Re: Christ as the fulfillment of all prophecy
« Reply #35 on: April 30, 2019, 09:24:39 AM »
Then why did God say the Jews were his chosen people? Why didn't he say the gentiles were? Because the Jews are very special people.
Greetings George, Nowhere is it said that the fleshly seed of Abraham are his chosen people~~that's a Jewish fable, not a biblical truth.
Quote from: Paul of the tribe of Benjamin
Romans 9:3-8~"For I could wish that myself were accursed from Christ for my brethren, my kinsmen according to the flesh: Who are Israelites; to whom pertaineth the adoption, and the glory, and the covenants, and the giving of the law, and the service of God, and the promises; Whose are the fathers, and of whom as concerning the flesh Christ came, who is over all, God blessed for ever. Amen. Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel: Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called. That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed."
"but the children of the promise are counted for the seed"~Only the children of God's promises are the TRUE children of Abraham~which also includes Gentiles.
Quote from: Paul again
Romans 3:29~Is he the God of the Jews only? is he not also of the Gentiles? Yes, of the Gentiles also"
Among the fleshly seed of Abraham and among the Gentiles God has a chosen people given to Jesus Christ to redeem them from sin and condemnation, which he perfectly did by his life, death and resurrection.
Quote from: JESSU CHRIST
John 10:16~And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd.
Again Paul wrote:
Quote
Ephesians 2:11-22~"Wherefore remember, that ye being in time past Gentiles in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands; That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world: But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ. For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us;  Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace; And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby: And came and preached peace to you which were afar off, and to them that were nigh. For through him we both have access by one Spirit unto the Father. Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God; And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone; In whom all the building fitly framed together groweth unto an holy temple in the Lord: In whom ye also are builded together for an habitation of God through the Spirit."
God's holy temple in which he shall dwell in throughout eternity is made up of BOTH Jews AND Gentiles. Enough said.....one fold, and one shepherd world without end.
"And he shewed me a pure river of water, clear as crystal, proceeding out of the throne of God and of the Lamb."~Revelation 22:1

In the world to come~there WILL BE "pure pleasures"~river/tree=all that is needed to sustain us Forever! Joy, peace, contentment in its fullest, etc.

Reformer

  • Affiliate Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 1789
  • Reformed and Evangelical
Re: Christ as the fulfillment of all prophecy
« Reply #36 on: April 30, 2019, 10:42:52 AM »
 )GoodPopst(

George

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 388
  • I'm a llama!
Re: Christ as the fulfillment of all prophecy
« Reply #37 on: May 01, 2019, 07:10:18 AM »
Greetings George, Nowhere is it said that the fleshly seed of Abraham are his chosen people

I'm not sure what you are getting at Red. Clearly it was said they are the chosen people. The liberal Amillennialists with their replacement theology distorts this. Are you one of them?

Deuteronomy 14:2
"For thou art a holy people unto Jehovah thy God, and thee hath Jehovah chosen for a people of possession unto himself, out of all the peoples that are upon the face of the earth."


Quote
that's a Jewish fable

No, that's a liberal amillennial fable. The truth is the scripture I gave you.


Quote
Yes, of the Gentiles also

Not true. Nowhere does the bible call Gentiles Israel. The liberals do and try to cause Israel harm, but the Bible literally supports Israel. We are so grateful that the President is on the side of literal Israel and not on the side of Amillennial liberal spiritualists who claim she has been replaced. Israel came back to be a nation because it was written literally that they would. And no Amillennialist liberal can stop her.

Quote
God's holy temple in which he shall dwell in throughout eternity is made up of BOTH Jews AND Gentiles.

God's holy Temple has not been rebuilt yet, but with the President making Jerusalem the Holy City and capital of Israel as foretold, you can expect that rebuilding very soon. You liberals deny the truth but God's people are Israel, not the Gentiles. They are those who must stand outside unless they accept the truth.

Red

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 297
  • Gender: Male
  • Galatians 2:16
Re: Christ as the fulfillment of all prophecy
« Reply #38 on: May 01, 2019, 10:04:15 AM »
I'm not sure what you are getting at Red.
Greetings George~I was just answering your post with scriptures~even though you made some statements without scriptural support concerning Israel after the flesh.
Quote from: George Reply #37 on: Today at 07:10:18 AM
Clearly it was said they are the chosen people
Not "are" but were in the OT~until the time of the true reformation period from OT to the NT~in which time the apostles who were Jews, interpreted the OT scriptures for us, to show us that a TRUE JEWS is one that is inwardly;  and true circumcision is that of the HEART, in the spirit. and NOT in the letter; whose praise is not men, but of God~through Jesus Christ's faith and obedience. See Romans 2:28,29; Philippians 3:1-9; etc. God's grace does not run through the bloodline, but THROUGH Jesus Christ's, life, death, and resurrection. To believe otherwise is to embrace another gospel which falls under God's curse per Galatians 1-5:4.
Quote from: George Reply #37 on: Today at 07:10:18 AM
The liberal Amillennialists with their replacement theology distorts this.
George, those who distort biblical truths are those who want to replace God's reveal revelation through his apostles to us with Jewish fables.
Quote from: George Reply #37 on: Today at 07:10:18 AM
Are you one of them?
I'll let Paul answer for me...
Quote from: George Reply #37 on: Today at 07:10:18 AM
Philippians 3:3-9~"For we are the circumcision, which worship God in the spirit, and rejoice in Christ Jesus, and have no confidence in the flesh. Though I might also have confidence in the flesh. If any other man thinketh that he hath whereof he might trust in the flesh, I more: Circumcised the eighth day, of the stock of Israel, of the tribe of Benjamin, an Hebrew of the Hebrews; as touching the law, a Pharisee; Concerning zeal, persecuting the church; touching the righteousness which is in the law, blameless. But what things were gain to me, those I counted loss for Christ. Yea doubtless, and I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord: for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and do count them but dung, that I may win Christ, And be found in him, not having my own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith":
The gift of eternal life is BY GRACE, not through race, but through Jesus Christ's faith, obedience and righteousness, whom the Jews rejected and still do, the ONLY hope for them is God's grace given FREELY through Jesus Christ.
Quote from: George Reply #37 on: Today at 07:10:18 AM
No, that's a liberal amillennial fable. The truth is the scripture I gave you.
George, whatever scriptures you can present to us, the apostle who were themselves JEWS, have interpreted their OT scriptures to point to the CHILDREN OF GOD'S PROMISES in Christ, made up of BOTH Jews and Gentiles. I provided you with Romans 9:4-8, you need to prayerfully consider those scriptures in the light of your doctrine that you hold to~they do not support your understanding.
Quote from: George Reply #37 on: Today at 07:10:18 AM
Not true. Nowhere does the bible call Gentiles Israel.
I must come back to this point and consider it in detail....later.
"And he shewed me a pure river of water, clear as crystal, proceeding out of the throne of God and of the Lamb."~Revelation 22:1

In the world to come~there WILL BE "pure pleasures"~river/tree=all that is needed to sustain us Forever! Joy, peace, contentment in its fullest, etc.

Dan

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 281
  • Gender: Male
  • Dan the Man
Re: Christ as the fulfillment of all prophecy
« Reply #39 on: May 01, 2019, 05:57:47 PM »
And what do you mean Christ is the fulfillment of all prophesy?  )Say_what(

Chicago Bear

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 289
  • Gender: Male
  • A Chicagoan Named Bear
Re: Christ as the fulfillment of all prophecy
« Reply #40 on: May 02, 2019, 02:26:05 AM »
Not true. Nowhere does the bible call Gentiles Israel.

Does Ephesians 2:12-13 not count?


Quote
We are so grateful that the President is on the side of literal Israel and not on the side of Amillennial liberal spiritualists who claim she has been replaced.

No one claims Israel has been replaced, the Israel of God will always be the Israel of God. Though some branches are broken off from her and some branches grafted in to her, she remains constant because she is not a political nation. She is a Spiritual nation.

Either the Bible will Keep you from Sin, or sin will keep you from the Bible

Tony Warren

  • Administrator
  • Affiliate Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2296
  • Gender: Male
    • The Mountain Retreat
Re: Christ as the fulfillment of all prophecy
« Reply #41 on: May 09, 2019, 12:17:16 PM »
>>>
You know you guys make such good arguments. I don't understand why people keep arguing the other side when it's so obvious that what you are saying is from scripture.
<<<

Hi Travis,
   It's because good arguments don't bring anyone to the truth. People think that it does, but it never does. That's a Biblically proven fact. If that were the case, then the Scribes and Pharisees and all the people of Israel that Christ preached the gospel to, would have thrown their hands up and all declared that He was right and they were wrong in their beliefs. Because He was the "Perfect" teacher, defender and arbiter of truth. But that didn't happen because good arguments don't bring anyone to truth, the Spirit of God does.

John 16:13
  • "Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come."

Without that Spirit of God dragging us to truth (John 6:44), not one of us would "receive" God's truth in love in acceptance of it. We'd be just like all others, convinced that this truth of God testified was merely the words of men. That's the essence of what deception is. A spirit of unbelief hereby men justifies lies in order to believe whatever they want. The whole world outside of the faithful Christian has a spirit of unbelief and is helplessly in bondage to sin. He is at enmity with the truth. That included many of the Israelites, and sadly that includes many professing Christians as well, since they are no better. So don't be surprised that most professing Christians will not receive the love of truth. Instead, be gratified and exceedingly thankful that God has been so merciful to you that you might receive it.

1st Thessalonians 2:13
  • "For this cause also thank we God without ceasing, because, when ye received the word of God which ye heard of us, ye received it NOT as the word of men, but as it is in truth, the word of God, which effectually worketh also in you that believe."

That's the difference, and we need to thank God, rather than pretend we are better than those who won't receive truth, smarter than those who are ignorant and without understanding, or more righteous than those who rwemain in their sins. The Scriptures that are witnessed to us "is not" to us as the words of men "only" because of the sovereign grace of God. That Spirit working within us that we (As the Noble Bereans) receive it with all readiness of mind as God's word.


Quote
>>>
I don't know where this reign of Christ on earth came from. Has it been around a long time?
<<<

It's been around almost since the prophesy was first delineated. It's been called by different names, but it's simply "carnal unbelief." The Scribes and Pharisees, the Priests and religious leaders believed it when Christ came to Jerusalem and preached of His Kingdom. At first they thought that He had come to physically set them at liberty from their oppressors the Romans, as they literally understood the prophecy to pertain. They believed that Their Messiah was to come and establish an Earthly kingdom and rule from the Holy physical city Jerusalem. And when they found out this was not the case, and that He spoke to them of Spiritual things, they quickly abandoned Him. i.e., His kingdom was not of this world and they wanted a Messiah who would come to rule in a kingdom of this world. They couldn't understand his Parables, Proverbs and Spiritual sayings because their minds were not Spiritual, but carnal. Thus they turned away from Him "because" Spiritual things just don't make sense to them. e.g.

John 6:56-66
  • "He that eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, dwelleth in me, and I in him.
  • As the living Father hath sent me, and I live by the Father: so he that eateth me, even he shall live by me.
  • This is that bread which came down from heaven: not as your fathers did eat manna, and are dead: he that eateth of this bread shall live for ever.
  • These things said he in the synagogue, as he taught in Capernaum.
  • Many therefore of his disciples, when they had heard this, said, This is an hard saying; who can hear it?
  • When Jesus knew in himself that his disciples murmured at it, he said unto them, Doth this offend you?
  • What and if ye shall see the Son of man ascend up where he was before?
  • It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.
  • But there are some of you that believe not. For Jesus knew from the beginning who they were that believed not, and who should betray him.
  • And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father.
  • From that time many of his disciples went back, and walked no more with him."

They turned away from Christ because He spoke of Spiritual things, and they didn't have the Spirit to understand them. As they confessed, indeed it was "A Hard Saying" that many of them could not hear because it was a Spiritual saying, and not addressing the physical needs and beliefs of the Kingdom that they harbored. Eat his flesh and drink His blood? Like the thinking of many in our day, to them Christ was a "Spiritualist." Didn't take the Bible literally. And from that time forward many of his disciples turned away from Him and walked no more with Him. Just as they think of us today as crazy Spiritualizers who distort the Kingdom narrative, when we are the ones with the eal Christ-centered truth of it. Selah.

So yes, these carnal belief systems have been around a long time. Premillennialists have built upon the errors that went before them, not invented them. There is nothing new under the sun.

"nosce te ipsum"
 
Peace,
Tony Warren
"i acknowledged my sin unto thee, and mine iniquity have I not hid. I said, I will confess my transgressions unto the Lord; and thou forgavest the iniquity of my sin. Selah. -Psalms 32:5"

Philly Dawg

  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 925
  • Thinking Christians
Re: Christ as the fulfillment of all prophecy
« Reply #42 on: May 10, 2019, 07:41:28 AM »
 )GoodPopst(  )God-Bless-You(
  Kellyanne Conway: Sometimes Trump Lies Because
 He Doesn't Know the Truth, Okay?

savedbysovereigngrace99

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 76
  • Obviously I'm a Novice
Re: Christ as the fulfillment of all prophecy
« Reply #43 on: May 31, 2019, 07:11:49 AM »
I read the thread Davis. It has not been explained where it says the so called conditional promises were fulfilled. It also has not been explained how God promised them the land forever unconditionally in Genesis 17 and most of you still say the land was promised conditionally? See the scripture.

Right ON! Don't let them bully you Joe. You are correct in your thinking based on the literal interpretation of Scripture.

Ge 17:8
"And I will give unto thee, and to thy seed after thee, the land wherein thou art a stranger, all the land of Canaan, for an everlasting possession; and I will be their God."

case closed!

Gen 17:8 is speaking of the new heavens and earth for believers. Peter writes here 2 Pet 3:13

Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.

Mila Ostrovsky

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 91
  • Gender: Female
  • Obviously I'm a Novice
Re: Christ as the fulfillment of all prophecy
« Reply #44 on: May 31, 2019, 09:42:27 AM »

I read the thread Davis. It has not been explained where it says the so called conditional promises were fulfilled. It also has not been explained how God promised them the land forever unconditionally in Genesis 17 and most of you still say the land was promised conditionally? See the scripture.

Right ON! Don't let them bully you Joe. You are correct in your thinking based on the literal interpretation of Scripture.

Ge 17:8
"And I will give unto thee, and to thy seed after thee, the land wherein thou art a stranger, all the land of Canaan, for an everlasting possession; and I will be their God."

case closed!

Bully him? Scripture is not a bully, it's truth. He can either accept it or deny it.

Genesis 17:8
"And I will give unto thee, and to thy seed after thee, the land wherein thou art a stranger, all the land of Canaan, for an everlasting possession; and I will be their God."

Israel has never had the physical land as an everlasting possession and so it is plain that is not what God was talking about. God even threw them out of the land. An everlasting or eternal land is not physical, it's the promised land of heaven. Let me quote you the scripture again.

Hebrews 11:10
"For he looked for a city which hath foundations, whose builder and maker is God."

Do you think that is a physical city just because God inspired the word city used? That's a spiritual city, the only everlasting place of Israel.

 


[ Home | Eschatology | Bible Studies | Classics | Articles | Sermons | Apologetics | Search | F.A.Q. ]