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Author Topic: Thou Art Weighed in the Balances and Art Found Wanting  (Read 483 times)

Tony Warren

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Re: Thou Art Weighed in the Balances and Art Found Wanting
« Reply #15 on: July 29, 2017, 05:26:50 AM »
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Tony, I hate to always be the "only one" challenging your flippant and frivolous statements...
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Actually they aren't flippant and frivolous, they were investigated systematically and seriously researched, but it is according to the true proverb, "one man's trash is another man's treasure"

 
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...but there's nothing in scripture that says God appoints a specific number to judgment.
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Daniel 5:26
  • "This is the interpretation of the thing: MENE; God hath numbered thy kingdom, and finished it."

[mene] is Aramaic and means numbered. So then, God numbered his kingdom, and if you will bother to read the context, brings it to an end in judgment. What is unclear about that declaration?

Daniel 5:30-31
  • "In that night was Belshazzar the king of the Chaldeans slain.
  • And Darius the Median took the kingdom, being about threescore and two years old."

In that very night the kingdom was finished.


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...Period.
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Yes, just as the prophesy said, it came to pass, period.


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 This is mere speculation on your part, which is typical of the non-literal positions of the futurist and Amillennial positions.
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Did not God number 70 years to accomplish the desolation of Jerusalem? After that 70 years, what happened? If God knew the number ahead of time, then the "number" was preordained, divinely appointed by God. It's not speculation that God does, and did this, it's Biblical fact.

Daniel 9:2
  • "In the first year of his reign I Daniel understood by books the number of the years, whereof the word of the LORD came to Jeremiah the prophet, that he would accomplish seventy years in the desolations of Jerusalem."

This passage is the very same principle of God numbering (appointing) 70 years to accomplish the desolation (judgment) of Jerusalem.


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Sovereignty only goes so far.
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If that were true, then it's not sovereignty. The definition of sovereignty is someone who is in total control, having supreme power and authority. i.e., God had supreme power and authority to number and accomplish exactly seventy years in the desolations of Jerusalem, as well as number the rule of this king in this wicked kingdom and finished it at His own appointed time. God's not simi-sovereign or sovereign to a point, he's sovereign, he's independent, he's autonomous, He's self-governing, He's monarchal and not ruled by man's ideas of justice, fairness, responsibility or determination.

"nosce te ipsum"
 
Peace,
Tony Warren
"I acknowledged my sin unto thee, and mine iniquity have I not hid. I said, I will confess my transgressions unto the Lord; and thou forgavest the iniquity of my sin. Selah. -Psalms 32:5"

Tony Warren

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Re: Thou Art Weighed in the Balances and Art Found Wanting
« Reply #16 on: July 29, 2017, 05:37:16 AM »
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I'm assuming the words Mene, Mene, Tekel and Upharsin mean something related.
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Those words are what was interpreted by Daniel as the messenger of God. [Mene] means "numbered," [tekel] means weighed and [upharsin] means divided. So the writing on the wall read, "numbered, numbered, weighed, divided." You can imagine how this would confuse the astrologers, Chaldeans, and soothsayers that the king inquired of, who had no knowledge of what it was about. It could have been anything from the distribution of meat, to the division of gold, to portioning of stones to a temple. There was no way for them to know.


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Why is Meme written twice?  Or is it?
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Yes, it is written twice. This because it is of great importance to know that it's a foregone conclusion. In other words, this outcome is absolutely certain for sovereign God has decided and appointed the time of the end. It's like when you read "verily, Verily" (Johhn 16:23) in Scripture, meaning "truly, truly," signifying that whatever was said or that is in view is assured or a certainty. Hope that helps.

"nosce te ipsum"
 
Peace,
Tony Warren
"I acknowledged my sin unto thee, and mine iniquity have I not hid. I said, I will confess my transgressions unto the Lord; and thou forgavest the iniquity of my sin. Selah. -Psalms 32:5"

lpowell

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Re: Thou Art Weighed in the Balances and Art Found Wanting
« Reply #17 on: July 29, 2017, 09:50:21 PM »
Verily, Verily...

This idea that the word repeated means certainty has predominated in translation.  But questions remain.  Why is every occurrence in John doubled, but every other use in the Greek is a single verily?  For example, is this verse any less certain?

1 John 2:5 But whoso keepeth his word, in him verily is the love of God perfected: hereby know we that we are in him.

May I suggest this possibility?  That the usage in John usually refers to our eternal spiritual life in Christ.  And the other gospels usually address life under the Old Covenant.

Lloyd

Tony Warren

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Re: Thou Art Weighed in the Balances and Art Found Wanting
« Reply #18 on: July 30, 2017, 09:11:20 AM »
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Why is every occurrence in John doubled, but every other use in the Greek is a single verily?
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I'm not sure of your basis for saying this. Are you implying that because only the Apostle John used the word "truly" twice means it's not doubled for emphasis? Or that because only He did this would indicate it's not for emphasis of the  following sentence? Lots of things are written only in one book of the Bible. But I would think that truly truly, written before a sentence, is to emphasize the certainty of its truth.  God said in the mouth of a "minimum" of 2 witnesses shall truth be established. Or for example as if I were to say, Truly Truly, I will come to your house today. It would be to establish the certainty that I will be there. As for example the dream of Pharaoh was doubled for emphasis that it "truly" would come to pass.

Genesis 41:32
  • "And for that the dream was doubled unto Pharaoh twice; it is because the thing is established by God, and God will shortly bring it to pass."


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May I suggest this possibility?  That the usage in John usually refers to our eternal spiritual life in Christ.  And the other gospels usually address life under the Old Covenant.
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Perhaps if it always referred to our eternal spiritual life. Or if the other gospels always addressed life under the thew Old Covenant. However, that is not the case. I find just as much about our our eternal spiritual life in the book of Matthew as I do in the book of John. I jst think verily verily means just that. Truly, Truly.

John 3:11
  • "Verily, verily, I say unto thee, We speak that we do know, and testify that we have seen; and ye receive not our witness."
John 6:53
  • "Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except ye eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, ye have no life in you."
John 8:34
  • "Jesus answered them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whosoever committeth sin is the servant of sin."
John 10:1
  • "Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that entereth not by the door into the sheepfold, but climbeth up some other way, the same is a thief and a robber."
John 13:21
  • "When Jesus had thus said, he was troubled in spirit, and testified, and said, Verily, verily, I say unto you, that one of you shall betray me."
John 13:38
  • "Jesus answered him, Wilt thou lay down thy life for my sake? Verily, verily, I say unto thee, The cock shall not crow, till thou hast denied me thrice."

Truly, Truly, I say unto you. Amen, Amen! This is what I think it signifies.


"nosce te ipsum"
 
Peace,
Tony Warren
"I acknowledged my sin unto thee, and mine iniquity have I not hid. I said, I will confess my transgressions unto the Lord; and thou forgavest the iniquity of my sin. Selah. -Psalms 32:5"

Mila Ostrovsky

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Re: Thou Art Weighed in the Balances and Art Found Wanting
« Reply #19 on: July 30, 2017, 01:57:47 PM »
 &TY  Tony

 


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