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Author Topic: What About the Law of Clean and Unclean Meats and Beasts  (Read 9623 times)

Rebel

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Re: What About the Law of Clean and Unclean Meats and Beasts
« Reply #30 on: September 24, 2003, 07:34:30 PM »
     
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anything manmade is never as good as what God has created.

     Of  course  not,  but  it  is  not  wrong  to  partake  in  something  manmade.  We  can't  always  have  the  best,  can  we?

     
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man is always trying to create alternatives to Gods ways from creating alternative foods to creating alternative gods.

     Yeah,  but  is  that  our  fault?  You're  talking  to  the  wrong  people,  Paul.  Take  your  argument  up  with  the  manufacturers  of  these  things.

     
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mans way will always be made more convenient and more tempting but is there not always a downside there's very few things man has created which doesn't have some sort of side effect.

     There's  plenty  of  things  man  didn't  create  that  have  side  effects.  And  that's  not  our  fault  either.

     
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and even that which is created with good intentions is always corrupted with the greed that follows.

     No  duh!  Everything  on  this  earth  has  been  corrupted  since  the fall,  like  Mike  said.

       
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i don't think artificial foods t.v. or radio was created to please God or to help our brothers i think they were created purely of mans mind with the creator thinking of how he would profit or be glorified by mankind.we should praise God and live by what He has created not praise man and live by what he has created.God has given us the gift to create that of our own kind and tells us to multiply and everything else he has created also creates more of its kind he has already given us the gift to create and created an everlasting supply of everything we need so why do we need to jeopardize their existence with our failure to be grateful and happy with what we've got and always wanting something better when there is nothing better than our Creator and what he has created


     Paul . . .  why  do  you  have  to  make  everything  so  hard?  There  is  nothing  wrong  with  manmade  items.  God  has  given  us  the  ability  to  create  so  what  do  we  do?  Create!  There  is  nothing  evil  about  making  something  new.  I  know  there  are  some  items  that  obviously  shouldn't  be  made  (like  bad  movies  and  harmful  drugs)  but  TV  and  radio  can  be  used  for  good  purposes.  They  may  have  been  created  to  serve  man's  purposes  but  doesn't  man  use  everything  to  serve  his  own  purposes?  Even  if  things  were  not  created  for  the  glory  of  God,  using  those  things  for  the  glory  of  God  is  not  a  sin.  And  often  what  man  intends  for  evil,  God  uses  for  good.  Just  some  things  to  think  about.
     Grace  be  with  you,
                                      Rebel  <><
Until  you  find  something  worth  dying  for,  you're  not  really  living.

     "Deo  Valente"

Paul

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Re: What About the Law of Clean and Unclean Meats and Beasts
« Reply #31 on: September 25, 2003, 06:27:32 PM »
do we not  give praise and thanks to God for what he has created.do we not also give praise and thanks to man for what he has created by partaking in his creations. by giving money for them when this money could help those in need.are we not encouraging them to create by partaking in and desiring their creations and making them rich.the only side effect to what God has created is mans inability to be satisfied and content with what he has been given and always wanting more regardless of how it effects others.if God uses mans creations for spreading his word and doing good this is only because the world is full of the things of man and there is no other way to get through to them for people reject the things of God in favour of the things of man for in the days of Jesus Christ did not Jesus say render therefore unto caesar the things which are caesars and unto Gods the things which are Gods. for the things of man are used to serve and please man but the things of God are used to serve and please God.if we trust in God he tells us what he wants us to do.do you think he would want anybody to create something that does us harm when he has already given us what we need for our good.
(Gen 4:7)  If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door. And unto thee shall be his desire, and thou shalt rule over him.

(Pro 3:5)  Trust in the LORD with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding.

Rebel

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Re: What About the Law of Clean and Unclean Meats and Beasts
« Reply #32 on: October 01, 2003, 08:29:39 PM »
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do we not  give praise and thanks to God for what he has created.

     I  sincerely  hope  so.

     
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do we not also give praise and thanks to man for what he has created by partaking in his creations.

     Yes,  if  that's  what's  in  our  heart  when  we're  partaking.  If  we're  buying  the  stuff  just  because  it's  there  and  thanking  God  for  gifting  man  with  the  ability  to  create,  I  can  find  no  fault  in  that.  But  if  we  are  like  Nebuchadnezzer  who  looks  at  the  great  city  of  Babylon  and  says,  "Is not this great Babylon, that I have built for the house of the kingdom by the might of my power, and for the honour of my majesty?"
(Daniel  4:30)  well  then  we  are  sinning  because  we  refuse  to  glorify  the  Lord.  

     
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by giving money for them when this money could help those in need.are we not encouraging them to create by partaking in and desiring their creations and making them rich.

     Did  it  ever  occur  to  you  that  it's  not  the  objects  themselves  that  are  sinful,  but  our  own  pride  and  arrogance  when  we  buy  them  and  don't  give  any  credit  to  God?  Man  creating  something  is  not  sinful.  Man  creating  something  and  honoring  himself  because  of  it  is  sinful.  As  long  as  our  hearts  are  in  the  right  place,  there's  nothing  wrong  with  creating  and  using  what  has  been  created.

     Man  is  going  to  praise  and  glorify  himself  no  matter  what  we  do.  He  uses  what  he  makes  to  sin  and  he  uses  what  he  doesn't  make  to  sin.  To  me  there  is  little  difference  in  his  attitude  toward  both.

     
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the only side effect to what God has created is mans inability to be satisfied and content with what he has been given and always wanting more regardless of how it effects others.

     Paul,  that's  not  true.  Anything  God  has  created  can  have  severe  side  effects  when  misused.

   
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if God uses mans creations for spreading his word and doing good this is only because the world is full of the things of man and there is no other way to get through to them for people reject the things of God in favour of the things of man

     God  does  not  need  the  things  of  man  to  get  through  to  people!  He  could  easily  make  everyone  in  the  world  turn  from  their  evil  and  follow  Him.  He's  not  the  God  of  "open-theism"  where  His  next  move  depends  on  what  man  does.  There  must  be  a  reason  he  uses  things  man  created  for  good  purposes  and  it  isn't  because  He's  limited  by  man's  rejection  of  the  things  of  God!

     
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for in the days of Jesus Christ did not Jesus say render therefore unto caesar the things which are caesars and unto Gods the things which are Gods.

     I  don't  see  how  you  can  apply  that  to  our  present  conversation.  This  is  referring  to  taxes.

     
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for the things of man are used to serve and please man but the things of God are used to serve and please God.

     It  depends  on  who's  using  those  things  and  how.  The  things  of  God  can  be  used  to  please  man  if  they  end  up  in  the  wrong  hands.  The  things  of  man  can  be  used  to  please  God  if  we  do  it  right.  I  think  a  lot  of  this  centers  around  the  thoughts  and  intentions  of  the  heart.

     
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if we trust in God he tells us what he wants us to do.

     Very  good.  And  how  do  you  think  He  does  that?  Through  His  word.  I  see  nowhere  in  the  Word  of  God  that  says  the  ability  man  has  to  create  new  things  is  not  a  gift  from  God.

     
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do you think he would want anybody to create something that does us harm when he has already given us what we need for our good.


     The  things  man  creates  will  do  us  harm  when  we  let  them.  God  provided  us  a  special  tool  that  helps  prevent  us  from  doing  stupid  things  with  what  we  create.  It's  called  a  brain.  He  gave  us  another  tool.  It's  called  a  conscience.  With  those  things  and  the  Holy  Spirit  guiding  us,  using  things  with  the  right  intentions  is  not  a  sin.

     Grace  be  with  you,
                                       Rebel  <><
Until  you  find  something  worth  dying  for,  you're  not  really  living.

     "Deo  Valente"

Paul

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Re: What About the Law of Clean and Unclean Meats and Beasts
« Reply #33 on: October 03, 2003, 03:21:32 PM »
God has given man the ability to do lots of things doesn't make what man does with his abilities right.God has given man the ability to create and has told him be fruitful and multiply but i don't think God has told any man today to create the things he has created,i think man has created them of his own mind.what God has created is for our good the only side effect is man using them to create something bad of his own mind.man is misusing Gods creations by using them to create what God had not intended to be created otherwise God would have created them himself in the beginning when he created for our every need.the creations of man has made us lazy and dependent on them and have polluted us and the things around us which are Gods creations.yes God is not limited by anything we do it's actually us who suffer but i think this saddens God.God doesn't use the things of man to do good he uses us who believe.we may use the things of man to spread Gods word and maybe even learn more about Him but this doesn't make them good or stop them from being used mainly for corrupting and polluting the things of God like our minds bodies and the enviroment all of which are Gods creations.it wasn't just taxes Jesus was talking about it was also money being a creation of mans mind (caesars).matthew 22v20 and he saith unto them whose is this image and superscription.for it was mans(caesars) used to praise caesar(man) God may have given caesar the ability to do these things but these things were not of God they were of man(caesar).i believe this does apply to  our present conversation for i believe Jesus was saying the things of man are used to serve and please man but the things of God are used to serve and please God.we are putting our trust in man when we partake of his creations and will suffer the harm that these cause but when we put our trust in Gods creations we will suffer no harm only be more equipped to help others.God is the creator not man.  
(Gen 4:7)  If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door. And unto thee shall be his desire, and thou shalt rule over him.

(Pro 3:5)  Trust in the LORD with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding.

Mike Repass

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Re: What About the Law of Clean and Unclean Meats and Beasts
« Reply #34 on: October 03, 2003, 08:52:54 PM »
around and around and around we go
where it will stop nobody knows  ;D

Rebel

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Re: What About the Law of Clean and Unclean Meats and Beasts
« Reply #35 on: October 11, 2003, 12:27:43 PM »
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around and around and around we go
where it will stop nobody knows
 

     You're  getting  dizzy  too,  Mike?  

     Paul,  first  it  was  food,  then  inventions,  now  it's  money.  And  on  and  on  and  on.

     Let  me  ask  you  something:  If  you're  so  dead-set  against  manmade  items,  then  why  are  you  participating  on  a  manmade  forum  using  manmade  internet  on  a  manmade  computer  run  by  manmade  electricity  or  battery  power,  and  you're  paying  for  it  all  with  manmade  money?  This  seems  a  little  hypocritical  to  me.  You  say  that  we  are  not  to  patake  in  man's  creations  that  he  glories  in  but  the  computer  and  internet  are  some  of  man's  most  gloried-in  accomplishments.  What's  wrong  with  this  picture?
Until  you  find  something  worth  dying  for,  you're  not  really  living.

     "Deo  Valente"

Paul

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Re: What About the Law of Clean and Unclean Meats and Beasts
« Reply #36 on: October 11, 2003, 06:36:16 PM »
yes i agree with you i am a hypocrite i have become dependent on mans creations but i wish i wasn't  for is it better to talk to someone like this or is it better to talk to them face to face i just think mans creations come at a cost to Gods i know we've drifted off the original point but it doesn't really bother me i don't mean to offend you or force my views on you in any way i'm just expressing my opinion you chose to reply to my threads why did you do this did you think my opinion is wrong why what is so wrong about my opinion do i speak against Gods word (yes you corrected me on unclean beasts and thankyou) but i see no wrong in my other opinions and you have replied to these. what i am actually talking about now and sorry if i haven't been clear is mans creations made of mans hands maybe i should have started a new thread.i was thinking of something else the other day which may benefit your argument but what of earthquakes volcanoes hurricanes and floods are these of God or of man meaning is it mans pollution to the world that causes them in some way or is it of Gods hand or some other reason you are under no obligation to reply if you think i'm too much of a hypocrite.
(Gen 4:7)  If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door. And unto thee shall be his desire, and thou shalt rule over him.

(Pro 3:5)  Trust in the LORD with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding.

Rebel

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Re: What About the Law of Clean and Unclean Meats and Beasts
« Reply #37 on: October 18, 2003, 07:38:33 PM »
     
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yes i agree with you i am a hypocrite i have become dependent on mans creations but i wish i wasn't  for is it better to talk to someone like this or is it better to talk to them face to face


     Don't  forget  that  if  Internet  had  not  been  invented,  we  wouldn't  be  having  this  conversation.  You're  in  Wales  and  I'm  in  the  USA.  Face  to  face  is  better  but  not  always  possible.

     
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i just think mans creations come at a cost to Gods i know we've drifted off the original point but it doesn't really bother me i don't mean to offend you or force my views on you in any way


     I'm  not  offended.   :)

     
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i'm just expressing my opinion you chose to reply to my threads why did you do this


     Because  I  thought  this  was  an  important  topic  and  I  can  relate  to  it.  I  struggled  with  the  clean/unclean  issue  for  quite  awhile  but  God  has  given  me  peace  about  it.  When  the  discussion  turned  to  other  things,  I  figured  since  I'd  started  talking  to  someone  I  might  as  well  follow  through.

     
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did you think my opinion is wrong why what is so wrong about my opinion

     It's  not  wrong  to  have  an  opinion.  I'd  just  feel  bad  leaving  you  like  this.  You  have  no  scriptural  support  for  your  opinion  and  I  think  it  would  be  sad  if  you  put  yourself  into  bondage  simply  because  you  thought  it  was  right.  But  if  this  is  what  you  really  want,  go  for  it.

     
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do i speak against Gods word (yes you corrected me on unclean beasts and thankyou)

     I  didn't  correct  you,  the  word  of  God  did.   ;)

     
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but i see no wrong in my other opinions and you have replied to these.

      I  never  intended  to  hurt  you.  I  agree  with  you  to  a  point.  A  steak  does  taste  much  better  than  a  burger  (especially  with  American  steak  sauce!   8))  and  many  things  man  created  should  never  be  anywhere  near  us.  A  lot  of  inventions  are  used  the  wrong  way  and  feed  man's  corruption  and  greed.  We  should  never  esteem  what  man  makes  higher  than  what  God  makes  because  God  is  the  superior  Creator.  The  Bible  even  says  that.  Glorying  in  man's  creations  is  a  sin.  Our  adoration  should  always  be  fixed  on  God  and  we  are  to  trust  in  Him,  not  man.  In  this  you  are  correct.  I  think  your  heart's  in  the  right  place.

     The  point  where  I  disagree  with  you  is  where  you  say  using  anything  made  by  man  is  sinful  and  harmful.  It  can  be  sinful  and  yes,  it  can  be  harmful.  But  the  same  could  be  said  for  God's  creation.  Man  didn't  create  tobacco  and  marijuana  but  somehow  he  manages  to  use  it  for  evil  and  reap  horrible  side  effects.  You  know  why?  Because  even  though  God  created  the  earth,  it's  all  been  corrupted  since  the  fall  so  whether  you  abstain  from  manmade  items  or  not,  you're  still  in  a  corrupt  world  that  God  will  destroy  one  day.

     
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what i am actually talking about now and sorry if i haven't been clear is mans creations made of mans hands maybe i should have started a new thread.

     Maybe.

   
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i was thinking of something else the other day which may benefit your argument but what of earthquakes volcanoes hurricanes and floods are these of God or of man meaning is it mans pollution to the world that causes them in some way or is it of Gods hand or some other reason

     Well  let's  see.  Volcanoes  are  holes  that  lead  to  deep  inside  the  earth  and  sometimes  erupt,  spewing  lava,  smoke  and  ashes.  This  is  not  caused  or  controlled  by  man,  but  can  be  beneficial  because  often  the  ash  and  lava  create  new  islands  and  enriches  soil.
     Earthquakes  are  when  the  plates  of  the  earth  shift.  Man  is  not  responsible  for  this  either.
     Hurricanes---  oh  boy,  as  a  Florida  resident  I  know  all  about  'canes.  Those  are  basically  large  storms  that  start  way  out  in  the  ocean  and  they  feed  off  wind  and  water.  Once  they  hit  land  the  worst  is  over  and  they  slowly  begin  to  diminish.  I  can't  think  of  anything  man  could  do  to  cause  a  hurricane.
     Floods  can  be  caused  by  any  number  of  things  and  sometimes  man  can  be  the  reason  for  it.  I  remember  flooding  the  bathroom  with  my  sister  when  we  were  really  little.   ;D  Of  course  you're  talking  about  much  more  disastrous  floods  like  too  much  rain  or  a  broken  dam.
     I  suppose  these  things  would  in  a  way  be  by  the  hand  of  God  since  He  controls  and  ordains  everything  that  comes  to  pass.

     
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you are under no obligation to reply if you think i'm too much of a hypocrite.


     Paul,  if  I  were  to  stop  talking  to  you  because  I  thought  you  were  too  much  of  a  hypocrite,  then  the  real  hypocrite  would  be  me.  I'm  just  an  ordinary  kid,  by  no  means  Miss  Perfect.  If  this  is  the  lifestyle  you  think  would  please  God  the  most,  then  as  long  as  the  intentions  of  your  heart  are  pure,  it's  okay.  All  I'm  saying  is  that  choosing  the  other  path,  with  the  right  intentions,  is  also  okay.  There  are  some  things  we  should  stick  to  without  compromise.  I  don't  think  this  is  one  of  them.

     Grace  be  with  you,
                                       Rebel  <><
Until  you  find  something  worth  dying  for,  you're  not  really  living.

     "Deo  Valente"

Paul

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Re: What About the Law of Clean and Unclean Meats and Beasts
« Reply #38 on: October 19, 2003, 12:01:29 PM »
i can see now that the body is not important,it's only the temple for the soul.it's the soul that's important and we are in danger of corrupting the soul with our needs and desires of the body.as it says in matthew 7v24-34 we shouldn't concern ourseves with needs of the body but seek the kingdom of God first and the needs of the body will be provided for.
but the problem i do have is what is considered unnatural and against nature and what are considered evil things as in inventors of evil things.as it says in romans chapter 1.
we know it mentions homosexuality,but what of other things like test tube babies,clones is all technology good when it seems to me that it takes us away from the God given uses for our bodies and replaces them with machines and science.for have our bodies become lazy with relying on the machines of man to do our work.will many more of us become infertile maybe from eating unnatural foods,but not worry about this because man has other ways to make us fertile.are we becoming lazy and dependent on the things of man instead of relying on what was naturally given of God.
i know some good can come out of these creations but at what cost and can we not achieve this good with the power of God in other ways.
i appreciate your patience and only seek the truth,the truth being Gods word,which i try to interperate the best i can and seek any ones understanding that God has blessed them with to help me and would like to think that i have also been blessed to help others.bacause isn't that what it's all about,helping each other however we can through our Lord.
God bless.
paul
(Gen 4:7)  If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door. And unto thee shall be his desire, and thou shalt rule over him.

(Pro 3:5)  Trust in the LORD with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding.

Rebel

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Re: What About the Law of Clean and Unclean Meats and Beasts
« Reply #39 on: November 05, 2003, 08:44:45 AM »
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i can see now that the body is not important,it's only the temple for the soul.

     Oh,  the  body  is  important  since  it  is  the  temple  of  God.  It's  just  not  the  most  important  thing.

   
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it's the soul that's important and we are in danger of corrupting the soul with our needs and desires of the body.

     This  is  only  true  if  we  allow  ourselves  to  be  corrupted  by  the  needs  of  the  body.  If  we,  like  the  Apostle  Paul,  bring  our  bodies  and  its  desires  under  control,  things  done  in  moderation  are  okay.

     
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as it says in matthew 7v24-34 we shouldn't concern ourseves with needs of the body but seek the kingdom of God first and the needs of the body will be provided for.

     That's  right.  The  kingdom  of  God  always  comes  first.

     
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but the problem i do have is what is considered unnatural and against nature and what are considered evil things as in inventors of evil things.as it says in romans chapter 1.

     Some  things  are  obviously  evil  and  should  be  avoided.  Our  freedom in  Christ  is  not  a  license  to  do  nasty  things  that  are  against  nature,  by  no  means!

     
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we know it mentions homosexuality,but what of other things like test tube babies,clones


     yyyyyyyyyyyyyyech,  is  there  no  end  to  the  depravity  of  man?  I  see  your  point  here.

       
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is all technology good when it seems to me that it takes us away from the God given uses for our bodies and replaces them with machines and science.for have our bodies become lazy with relying on the machines of man to do our work.will many more of us become infertile maybe from eating unnatural foods,but not worry about this because man has other ways to make us fertile.are we becoming lazy and dependent on the things of man instead of relying on what was naturally given of God.

     I  am  not  the  least  bit  surprised  that  man  uses  technology  to  his  own  advantage  and  has  grown  fat  and  lazy  because  of  it.  But  when  you  really  think  about  it,  there's  nothing  on  this  earth  that  man  hasn't  used  for  evil.  Whether  God  created  it  or  man  created  it,  sin  has  corrupted  it.
     Perhaps  we  shouldn't  be  as  dependent  upon  technology  as  we  are  today,  but  technology  itself  is  not  evil.  Sodom  and  Gomorrha  had  no  trouble  getting  themselves  burnt  to  a  crisp  without  a  spark  of  electricity.  High  tech  or  not,  man  is  a  natural  antichristo  and  will  refuse  to  acknowledge  God  in  what  he  does  make  or  doesn't  make.  Having  the  conveniences  of  today  or  not  having  them  will  have  no  effect  on  our  depraved  natures.  We  are  not  to  worship  material  things  but  there's  no  point  in  considering  them  evil  in  themselves.

     
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i know some good can come out of these creations but at what cost and can we not achieve this good with the power of God in other ways.

     I'm  afraid  that  with  or  without  man's  creations,  the  situation  of  humanity  will  be  unchanged.  Strip  away  all  our  accomplishments  and  you  still  have  a  bunch  of  dustrags  rotten  to  the  core.  It's  not  what  we  do  on  the  outside  that's  the  problem.  It's  the  inner  sinful  nature  that  is  the  problem.  Only  if  God  cleanses  us  can  we  use  creations  (God's,  man's,  Joe  Blow's,)  to  the  glory  of  God.

     
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i appreciate your patience and only seek the truth,the truth being Gods word,which i try to interperate the best i can

     None  of  us  are  perfect  at  interpreting  God's  Word.  That's  why  we  have  the  Holy  Spirit.

     
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and seek any ones understanding that God has blessed them with to help me and would like to think that i have also been blessed to help others.bacause isn't that what it's all about,helping each other however we can through our Lord.

     Keep  searching  the  word  Paul,  and  ask  the  Holy  Spirit  to  guide  you.

     Grace  be  with  you,
                                       Rebel  <><
Until  you  find  something  worth  dying  for,  you're  not  really  living.

     "Deo  Valente"

Melanie

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Re: What About the Law of Clean and Unclean Meats and Beasts
« Reply #40 on: September 20, 2015, 02:35:56 PM »
In reading this thread, I thought it should be revisited because no one really addressed the true nature of the laws of clean and unclean meats. And for some reason, Tony didn't participate. I think this article by Tony Warren addresses the meat (no pun intended) of the issue very well.

http://www.mountain-retreat.org/faq/what-about-clean-and-unclean-meats.shtml

It's not, nor has it ever been about diet, but about the spiritual nature of the people of Israel.

Emily

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Re: What About the Law of Clean and Unclean Meats and Beasts
« Reply #41 on: September 20, 2015, 05:29:31 PM »
Thanks melanie. Interesting.

Melanie

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Re: What About the Law of Clean and Unclean Meats and Beasts
« Reply #42 on: September 21, 2015, 11:12:29 AM »
Thanks melanie. Interesting.

I think too often Christians set their eyes on the physical body when the spiritual body is the thing that is most often in view. Just as they look at national Israel instead of spiritual Israel.

 Colossians 3:1-2
"If ye then be risen with Christ, seek those things which are above, where Christ sitteth on the right hand of God.  Set your affection on things above, not on things on the earth".

 I think it's all part of that same mentality of setting our sights on this world instead of the world to come.

Reformed Baptist

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Re: What About the Law of Clean and Unclean Meats and Beasts
« Reply #43 on: September 21, 2015, 06:20:37 PM »
 :iagree:

"For the kingdom of God is not meat and drink, but righteousness and peace and joy in the Holy Spirit. For he that in these things serveth Christ is acceptable to God and approved of (lit. for) men" (vv. 17, 18).

James Heckman

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Re: What About the Law of Clean and Unclean Meats and Beasts
« Reply #44 on: September 23, 2015, 05:56:13 AM »

http://www.mountain-retreat.org/faq/what-about-clean-and-unclean-meats.shtml

It's not, nor has it ever been about diet, but about the spiritual nature of the people of Israel.

Melanie,
   This is "not" the Reformed view of the right and wrong of eating clean and unclean meats. So it's unorthodox. Really, it reminds me of the article he did about fasting not being a physical fast, despite the fact that the disciples fasted. They are both very unorthodox and I think reaching. I think fasts are still good for today and also there are still clean and unclean meats.

 


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