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Author Topic: Should Christians Evangelize or Preach to Jews  (Read 10779 times)

Lieberman

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Re: Should Christians Evangelize or Preach to Jews
« Reply #15 on: January 11, 2005, 11:26:39 AM »
There are a lot of Christian groups and churches who do not believe that Christians should preach the gospel to the Jewish people. I believe at last count there were over 30 Christian groups, organizations or denominations that are outright opposed to Christians directing their preahing at any Jewish people. Is it the reformed practice to witness Christ to the Jews?

The people who I have talked with who believe this say that they believe that it is wrong to do this because the Jews have a special covenant with God that allows them to be saved without confessing Christ. They say the Jews are a special case and it's insulting to them to have Christ preached. I'm divided. My question is twofold. Should Christians even preach to Jews, and does the Jews have a separate covenant with God? I'd appreciate hearing your beliefs on this and why.

Thanks,
  Marty

Dave Taylor

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Re: Should Christians Evangelize or Preach to Jews
« Reply #16 on: January 12, 2005, 09:49:43 AM »
Only groups adhereing to some form of Dispensatanalism would promote this prevention of evangelization.

Dispensatanalism teaches that the Jews will automatically and corporately come to God regardless of what the church does; therefore many who adhere to dispensatanalism continue to drive their stake of segregation between the Jews and the church; and never the twain shall meet; in their eyes.

Scripture however, has the gospel charge going out from beleivers to all men of all nations.  Stick with that charge; and punt the dispensatanalism baloney.

Baerchild

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Re: Should Christians Evangelize or Preach to Jews
« Reply #17 on: January 13, 2005, 09:57:16 PM »
Marty,

From the viewpoint of the Bible, who is a Jew?   Romans 2:25-29 For circumcision verily profiteth, if thou keep the law: but if thou be a breaker of the law, thy circumcision is made uncircumcision. Therefore if the uncircumcision keep the righteousness of the law, shall not his uncircumcision be counted for circumcision? And shall not uncircumcision which is by nature, if it fulfil the law, judge thee, who by the letter and circumcision dost transgress the law? For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh: But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.
Look closer at this: For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh: But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.
Christians certainly preach to National Israel...National Ireland and England as well.  That's what we do...spread The Gospel.

Jim

Gods Child

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Re: Should Christians Evangelize or Preach to Jews
« Reply #18 on: January 14, 2005, 01:05:02 PM »
AMEN!

Spread it to any and all who would hear it.
Were here to sow if the seed doesn't take it's been planted and that's that.

Remember we are all grafted on the vine together, God hasn't given up on His 12 tribes just yet!

Preach the word, plant the seed and let God water the garden hey, and if it's supposed to grow it will and it will be fruitfull according to God's will.  :)
Pro 1:7 
The fear of the LORD is the beginning of knowledge: but fools despise wisdom and instruction.

Lieberman

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Re: Should Christians Evangelize or Preach to Jews
« Reply #19 on: January 24, 2005, 06:47:17 PM »
Should Christians attempt to evangelize Jews

http://www.abrock.com/Attempt.html

I have read the few responses I've gotten. It seems this is an issue that few want to discuss. But what are your feelings on what this article states? Do you agree it is biblical, or disagree, and why? I know that Gentiles can be Jews. But can Jews be Gentiles, or is there a special relationship?

Baerchild

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Re: Should Christians Evangelize or Preach to Jews
« Reply #20 on: January 24, 2005, 10:41:49 PM »
Marty,

The Lord has blessed you with a desire to search the entire Bible...it's that or you're tied into one of these Messanic apologetic groups, always looking for a literal temple and all sorts of benefits for national Israel. Here's a thought: There's a remnant from all nations, including national Israel.  But could it be that they were divorced at The Cross?  You know, they are into Idolatry...they idolize their nation. 

Jim


Miguel Angel Chaparro

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Re: Should Christians Evangelize or Preach to Jews
« Reply #21 on: January 25, 2005, 12:23:50 AM »
Seek our LORD in prayer that He may give you the wisdom for this matter, for it is not something easy to deal with in mans wisdom but of God guidance.

Psa 48:1 Great is the LORD, and greatly to be praised in the city of our God, in the mountain of His holiness.

Lieberman

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Re: Should Christians Evangelize or Preach to Jews
« Reply #22 on: January 25, 2005, 04:15:46 AM »
Thank you both for your encouragement, but the question I asked concerned the article.

http://www.abrock.com/Attempt.html

No one has answered the question. What are your feelings on what this article states? Do you agree it is biblical, or disagree, and why?

 Romans 9:4 Who are Israelites; to whom pertaineth the adoption, and the glory, and the covenants, and the giving of the law, and the service of God, and the promises;
 5 Whose are the fathers, and of whom as concerning the flesh Christ came, who is over all, God blessed for ever. Amen.

These scriptures seem quite clear that to the Jews belong the glory, covenants and promises. Isn't Paul talking about the natural Jews here? Yes the Lord has blessed me with a desire to search the Bible and ask questions. But Christians seem unprepared to give me any answers to my questions.


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Re: Should Christians Evangelize or Preach to Jews
« Reply #23 on: January 25, 2005, 08:02:44 AM »
Rom 2:28-29
28 For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:
29  But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.

Mat 12:46-50
46  While he yet talked to the people, behold, his mother and his brethren stood without, desiring to speak with him.
47  Then one said unto him, Behold, thy mother and thy brethren stand without, desiring to speak with thee.
:48  But he answered and said unto him that told him, Who is my mother? and who are my brethren?
49  And he stretched forth his hand toward his disciples, and said, Behold my mother and my brethren!
50  For whosoever shall do the will of my Father which is in heaven, the same is my brother, and sister, and mother.


There are many Scriptures of this nature in the Bible (some already given by others earlier),  that attest to the fact that God is concerned with the inward man -- not the outer one, and is no 'respecter of persons'. 

This question about the 'Jews' is not difficult to answer, if one were to simply accept God's (instead of man's) definition of who the real Jews are, and honorably search the Scriptures for truth and harmony, instead of being carnally minded, seeking support for one's own personal biases or agendas.

judy
'For ever, O LORD, thy word is settled in heaven.'   Ps 119:89

Miguel Angel Chaparro

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Re: Should Christians Evangelize or Preach to Jews
« Reply #24 on: January 25, 2005, 10:44:32 AM »
Thank you both for your encouragement, but the question I asked concerned the article.

http://www.abrock.com/Attempt.html

No one has answered the question. What are your feelings on what this article states? Do you agree it is biblical, or disagree, and why?

 Romans 9:4 Who are Israelites; to whom pertaineth the adoption, and the glory, and the covenants, and the giving of the law, and the service of God, and the promises;
 5 Whose are the fathers, and of whom as concerning the flesh Christ came, who is over all, God blessed for ever. Amen.

These scriptures seem quite clear that to the Jews belong the glory, covenants and promises. Isn't Paul talking about the natural Jews here? Yes the Lord has blessed me with a desire to search the Bible and ask questions. But Christians seem unprepared to give me any answers to my questions.



Here is and article that you can read and compare the views in.

http://www.mountainretreatorg.net/bible/israel2.html

Psa 48:1 Great is the LORD, and greatly to be praised in the city of our God, in the mountain of His holiness.

Drew

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Re: Should Christians Evangelize or Preach to Jews
« Reply #25 on: January 25, 2005, 03:37:17 PM »
Lieberman,
  I find it "extremely interesting" that not one of these honest open reformed christians here  ::)  have answered your specific question about the article about Jews. You did notice that, didn't you? Maybe because you are Jewish, they are afraid of your question, as they have moved heaven and hell not to answer it.

What has the responses you've been given have to do with that article and it's conclusions based upon scripture?

If you want answers, maybe you should go to a Messianic board where people answer questions. They ignore my questions here also. They don't like new people especially.


PS. I doubt they even bothered to read the article.

Miguel Angel Chaparro

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Re: Should Christians Evangelize or Preach to Jews
« Reply #26 on: January 25, 2005, 10:30:56 PM »
Lieberman,
  I find it "extremely interesting" that not one of these honest open reformed christians here  ::)  have answered your specific question about the article about Jews. You did notice that, didn't you? Maybe because you are Jewish, they are afraid of your question, as they have moved heaven and hell not to answer it.

What has the responses you've been given have to do with that article and it's conclusions based upon scripture?

If you want answers, maybe you should go to a Messianic board where people answer questions. They ignore my questions here also. They don't like new people especially.


PS. I doubt they even bothered to read the article.


Your entitle to your opinion, but what you just said is not true.
Some of us  here already know that the Israel of God is those born by the Spirit of God and not by the letter. So some of the answer are limited not because there is no response, plus I gave him a link of a good article that brakes it very well for him to view better than I could have. Also there is many people like my self that work and go to school so you might not get a answer for few days.

Psa 48:1 Great is the LORD, and greatly to be praised in the city of our God, in the mountain of His holiness.

Miguel Angel Chaparro

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Re: Should Christians Evangelize or Preach to Jews
« Reply #27 on: January 25, 2005, 10:47:26 PM »
This will answer some of the question he already has! 


and quote,
 
 Based upon the clear teachings of God's holy, inerrant, unbroken, verbally inspired Word, our purpose in this study on THE TRUE ISRAEL OF GOD is to show that the Scriptures teach in clear, bold, unmistakable truths, that all believers, God's children by the new birth, are the true Israel of God; and that they, and they alone, are God's chosen people upon the earth today and are the present heirs of the promises made to Abraham and his seed in Christ.

We will also be setting forth that the physical nation of Israel in the land of Palestine in the Near East today, is not God's chosen people or nation after the flesh, and neither will they ever again be dealt with as a nation in a so-called 1000 years of earthly prosperity with Christ sitting upon an earthly throne in Jerusalem. No, the Scriptures plainly teach that the nation of Israel was set aside at Calvary and that God's dealing with them now is the same as His dealings with the Gentiles: "For there is no respect of persons with God: there is no difference between Jew and Gentile for all have sinned and come short of the glory of God" (Rom 2:1, 3:22-23).

This precious truth of true believers being the true Israel of God has been lost among the rubble and trash of the false teaching of the past 150 years which says that God will yet deal with Israel as a nation, His chosen nation, and that most all of the promises of the Old Testament given to Israel are physical promises and not spiritual and that the Jew will again arise as the chosen people of God in a so-called 1000 year reign of Christ upon this earth.

As I have studied this subject in the past years, I have been greatly blessed to see my spiritual position in Christ, based upon His election of grace, and how that I, as a child of God, am an heir of Abraham and the promises made to him in Christ as his seed. My one desire therefore in setting forth these truths is to magnify my risen, exalted Lord Jesus Christ who sits upon His throne in heaven now ruling over His people and over all of the inhabitants of this earth. "All power [all authority] is given unto me [Christ] in heaven and in earth" (Mat 28:18). "Who is gone into heaven, and is on the right hand of God; angels and authorities and powers being made subject unto him" (1Pet 3:22). For God has set Christ "at his own right hand in the heavenly places, far above all principality, and power, and might, and dominion, and every name that is named, not only in this world, but also in that which is to come: and hath put all things under his feet, and gave him to be the head over all things to the church, which is his body, the fullness of him that filleth all in all" (Eph 1:20-23). We will seek to show from God's Word that our Lord Jesus Christ is now King of kings and Lord of lords and that He already sits upon David's throne in the heavenlies.

Psa 48:1 Great is the LORD, and greatly to be praised in the city of our God, in the mountain of His holiness.

Baerchild

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Re: Should Christians Evangelize or Preach to Jews
« Reply #28 on: January 26, 2005, 01:30:58 AM »
Marty,

From what I've read of your understanding, there's a pretty good chance that you are not a Jew...that's from a strictly Biblical viewpoint.  But that is not to say that you will never become one.

Do you really understand the eternal, spiritual significance of just what a Jew really is? A Jew has NOTHING to do with National Israel, from the sense of being a spiritual descendant of Abraham.

Jim


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Re: Should Christians Evangelize or Preach to Jews
« Reply #29 on: January 26, 2005, 04:42:03 AM »
Thank you both for your encouragement, but the question I asked concerned the article.

http://www.abrock.com/Attempt.html

No one has answered the question. What are your feelings on what this article states? Do you agree it is biblical, or disagree, and why?

Hi Lieberman, a belated welcome to the forum. You're right, no one has yet answered the question you put forth, and there does seem to be some rudeness here from one individual. So let me be the first to try and answer the question.

 1 Peter 3:15 "But sanctify the Lord God in your hearts: and be ready always to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is in you with meekness and fear:"

First, I did read the article, and my feelings about it is that it is a unwise apology for the Bible. God sent us to evangelize the world. Jewish people are part of the world. So the question itself seems somewhat contrived, no?

The article seems to be attempting to apologize for Christianity. Christianity has to deny the validity of the Old Jewish law because it is based on a false concept of salvation. By definition, Christ or Christian religion is opposed to any salvation by works of the law. Observing the Torah for salvation cannot be of God, and should never be condoned by any Christian. As Christians we reject the concept of natural Jews being anymore special today than Gentiles. But also, not any less special either. We all stand on the same ground, and that's what people like this author of that article  does not understand. Jewish people who seek and find the deliverer Jesus and become of Christ are the true Israel of God. And the natural Jews who would abandon them (according to that article) as traitors are not really the Israel of God. Thus they are not the covenant people and cannot lay claim to any of the covenant blessings.

 Romans 9:7-8 "Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called.
 That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed."

If we believe the scriptures we have to accept God's word rather than this author's ideas about Judaism and the Israel of God. You said Romans 9:4 seems quite clear that to the Jews belong the glory, covenants and promises. No one here denies that. Yes, Paul was talking about the natural Jews in that context. But only those who were also spiritual Jews. Some were not. That's what Romans 9:7-8 that I referenced says. All Israel is not Israel, only some of them are.  It is only a remnant that are Israel in God's sight. So to answer your question, the article seems flawed to me on a very basic christian level.
"And again he said, Whereunto shall I liken the kingdom of God? It is like leaven, which a woman took and hid in three measures of meal, till the whole was leavened". Luke 13:20-21

 


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