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Author Topic: Right Wing Republican Racists  (Read 15758 times)

Chris

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Re: Right Wing Republican Racists
« Reply #30 on: April 29, 2014, 03:20:15 AM »
As a black woman myself, I can say without fear of contradiction by any enabler or justifier that both the comments of Republicans Cliven Bundy and Donald Sterling were blatantly Racist, and anyone defending them are Racist also. Whether in the closet or out, whether they know it or not, whether its subconscious or not, it makes no difference to me.


I understand what you are saying. Racism seems to be defined in different ways by certain groups, but in general, I think we all know what racism is. And Cliven Bundy and Donald Sterling fit the bill. As for those who support them, some are misguided, some are trouble makers or rabble rousers (like those who came down there with automatic weapons), some are racists and some are just plain not very smart. Whether they are Christian or not, I do not know. But I do know they are not following Christian teachings. That much is plain.


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It really isn't very hard to tell when someone feels resentment against other races. You don't need a Ph.D.

 :iagree: And that's racism. But Diane, don't let a few people dissuade you from your participation here. We love you and have been blessed by your posts, presence and doctrines which always are faithful. I can tell you are hurt by some of the things said here, but you should also see that it's only a few. Not the forum at large. When people make the type of insensitive comments they do, it's usually because they are being defensive, so I hope you don't take it personal.


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I would go further and say I don't think anyone in their right mind doesn't know these men are racist. But its an emotional issue and that blinds people sometimes. But thank you for keeping it real. Philly Dawg, You too!

And thank you for your views as well. I understand your frustration, but we just lay our burdens upon Christ and he'll carry them for us.
 
Blessings to you and yours
We need more conservatives like you, not less.

Chris

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Re: Right Wing Republican Racists
« Reply #31 on: April 29, 2014, 03:21:23 AM »
This is what settles it for me. I agree with this one point. That Christ would have nothing to do with them or their cause. And so neither will I. We are witnesses to the truth, not revolutionaries. Because If Christ wouldn't support them, then neither can I as a follower of Christ. Just my two cents worth.

 :GoodPopst: I'm inclined to agree with you.

John

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Re: Right Wing Republican Racists
« Reply #32 on: April 29, 2014, 03:36:40 AM »
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I don't like John's opinion, but I believe in the constitution and that he is entitled to it.

Well, thanks. I think. A bit of a backhanded compliment, but okay.

If you don't mind, I'll use your response as a jumping off point to wrap things up.

Why did I bother with this thread? I mean, is there anything gained by correcting and trying to educate angry, irrational people? We'll I think so. There is a goal to all these electrons spent on this subject, at least I hope it makes a difference to some unnamed lurker out there.

I realize that haters gotta hate - and I'm not going to take irrational people and change them. While, falsely-called racism is an important topic and a rampant problem it is the slandering that I wanted to expose most. Even if the majority who read through these posts leave just as ignorant, it will be great if just one person stops and thinks about their motivation before jumping to unfounded conclusions. If in the future, before attacking with the crowd and pouncing on someone's poorly chosen words, they instead stop and make a considered and honest judgment based on the facts, even when it is unpopular with the crowd, and even with full knowledge that the haters will spitefully attack you, then you've learned a valuable thing and that, in my opinion, is more Christ-like. Christians can't go with the crowd when the crowd is wrong. 

My simple goal is to, perhaps, get a few rational people to think more carefully about race and if nothing else, leave the personal attacks out of their conversation. Everyone has to have a reasonable defense for the statements they make, or you shouldn't be making them. Smearing people or groups is ugly and no one should fall into that trap, especially people who say they are Christians. Inversely, slander needs to be corrected, there is no justification or excuse for it.

But also, if I've unnecessarily offended some folks innocently caught in the crossfire, then I apologize. And for those who are not innocent - my rebuke of them stands, as does my unchallenged and unanswered points. However, arguing with people who are running on emotion has no chance of success, and since my main points have been clearly put forth (many times), there is no point in repeating them or exposing the irrationality of others continuously ad infinitum. So, I'll let leave off now.

If you walk away with nothing else, just know that Christians can engage in free political discussion and can express their opinions - they can believe whatever they wish, right or wrong. But no one, especially Christians, are to slander and defame people, or groups of people, or engage in ad hominem attacks, not on this forum or anywhere else. Sure, the world does it - but you aren't of this world! If you can't understand this or think it doesn't apply to you (or me) then you need to go back and read through this thread again and again until it sinks in.

Thanks for your consideration,

john
Si hoc signum legere potes, operis boni in rebus Latinus alacribus et fructuosis potiri potes!

Trevor

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Re: Right Wing Republican Racists
« Reply #33 on: April 29, 2014, 04:28:03 AM »
Wow John! I haven't logged on for a while and I decide to log on tonight and I am shocked. I was not aware that you were so angry and so into the extremist right. I mean, from reading your posts I knew you favored the far right conservative issues (nothing wrong with that), but this supporting (or seeming to support) Bunday and armed men coming to his ranch to stand against Federal agents? These are just law enforcement officers, people with jobs like you and me? And then calling these police officers terrorists? Now that's not only strange, that's a shocker for me. I guess that proves the old adage, you just never know about the people you are reading posts from on the internet. Because reading your writings about Christian issues, I would have never in a thousand years pictured you so into these militant anti-government issues and groups. If you were to see me now, you'd see me sitting here with my mouth wide open. Please don't bite my head off, and please don't give me a history lesson, but you don't find this at all a conflict with serving Christ? How is that possible?
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Philly Dawg

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Re: Right Wing Republican Racists
« Reply #34 on: April 29, 2014, 02:32:49 PM »
All evidence is that Sterling is neither an active Republican nor Democrat --

john


That's not true, just one more distortion of truth by John. Sterling is a confirmed Registered Republican who votes Republican. Look it up and stop with your blind denials!


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Philly Dawg

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Re: Right Wing Republican Racists
« Reply #35 on: April 29, 2014, 02:39:06 PM »

 :peace: Kudows for New NBA comissioner Adam Silver for taking such strong "and Quick" actions against the Racist John Sterling and banning him for life. Good to know there are a few good people left in this world.

That's the difference between Adam Silver and John. Adam doesn't play games with words or try and justify this man's remarks by claiming he was misunderstood, or blame the Democrats for his words about Blacks, or start ranting about the the police being government terrorists. He knows what Racism is, and He called it exactly what it was. That's the difference between logical thinking people and radicals who do nothing but pass the blame on to liberals for all problems.

Good for Adam Silver! I'm sure much to John's chagrin, he made a tough decision and will be condemned for it. But he did the right thing. That's all anyone can ask of a man.

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Philly Dawg

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Re: Right Wing Republican Racists
« Reply #36 on: April 30, 2014, 12:57:15 AM »
God’s Messenger Cliven Bundy, His Wacko Disciples, and Uncivil Disobedience

By Elaine Magliaro,

Cliven Bundy, the Nevada rancher and scofflaw, was hailed by some people as a folk hero and patriot recently when he—and his followers–engaged in a standoff with the Bureau of Land Management (BLM). Caty Enders (Esquire) described the scene in Bunkerville, Nevada, as pundits and politicians descended on the Bundy camp last week “to throw in their American flag hats with the BLM protestors.” She said that a FOX News van had been parked by the side of the road for days—and that “militia snipers kept a trained watch” up on a ridge “as Bundy held court.” She added that disciples of Bundy came from far and wide “to share their personal theories as to why the government was enforcing a court order.”

Bundy has had a number of advocates who have spoken in support of his militant stance against the BLM. Those advocates included some prominent politicians and members of the media. Sean Hannity was one of Bundy’s biggest boosters and helped to make him into a folk hero. Hannity talked with Bundy on a number of occasions on his Fox News show. Joan Walsh (Salon) asked a pertinent question about Bundy on Friday: “How does a guy who declared early on ‘I don’t recognize the United States government as even existing’ become a folk hero in the first place?” She said that both Hannity and Fox News should have realized that the Nevada rancher was “too toxic” prior to his “ongoing self-exposure as a racist.” She added that the extremism of Bundy’s statement about the US government “should have been warning enough that Bundy was not only crazy but dangerous…”

Enders posed a question that was in the same vein as Walsh’s: “Exactly how difficult was it, though, to determine pretty early on that Bundy and his followers were using the threat of force to back up some terrifyingly misguided beliefs?” Enders provided some insight into the thinking and beliefs of Bundy and disciples of his with whom she talked.

Members of the Bundy Brigade Speak Out

Enders spoke to a militia member named Mark who was affiliated with the Oath Keepers group. Mark explained to her “the truth behind public land management.” He said, “The assumption is that the BLM is part of the federal government. But we need to check the facts on that one. The BLM doesn’t work for the government: they work for the United Nations. They might as well be wearing blue helmets. If we find out there’s money being exchanged between Harry Reid and the Chinese government, no one should be surprised.”

Another Bundy disciple told Enders that “Bar-certified lawyers, like the ones who prosecuted Bundy, have sworn loyalty to the British government, whose statutes encourage sex with clients. ‘That’s what they do with all their clients.’”

Enders spent time talking to a former cop who chuckled as he related a story about one of his buddies who once worked as a sheriff in New Mexico. He said his buddy got into some trouble after he pulled over a group of illegals one night. He said his pal “didn’t have room to haul ‘em all, so he put a chain around their neck and put a padlock through it, went to the next one, then he chained ‘em to a tree!” Enders said that the former cop then buckled with laughter as he told her how his friend “left ‘em and went to town to get his pickup to haul ‘em all back in. So, you might imagine, that didn’t play well — ha! You’re a young’un, but everything wasn’t against the law, way back when.” The former cop also told Enders that it was now being proved that the Bureau of Land management was acting on orders “from Troy and Harry Reid, who want to build a solar farm on the land  —  or a wind farm.”

One of Bundy’s disciples drove a beige sedan covered with the following message:

IF YOU WERE BORN IN 1980 AND AFTER. YOU MAY BE IMPLANTED WITH A GOVERNMENT MICROCHIP WITHOUT YOUR KNOWLEDGE: GOOGLE DOCTORS THAT REMOVE MICROCHIPS.

Cliven Bundy, God’s Messenger

During the time that Enders spent at the Bundy camp, she witnessed one of the public addresses the Nevada rancher made to his followers. She said that as Bundy—who had just been given a standing ovation—took the stage, he didn’t seem pleased. She said that Bundy reproached the crowd “for failing to follow the word of God – to the letter …”— which he claimed was being “delivered through him.” He wasn’t happy that his supporters failed “to follow his instructions to tear down the toll booths at Lake Mead and disarm the Park Service.” Bundy added, “The message I gave to you all was a revelation that I received. And yet not one of you can seem to even quote it.” He continued, “The records of our bible — how long have they been kept? Thousands of years. They’ve been turned over generation after generation, buried, and all kinds of things happen to ‘em. And yet, here, something I felt was inspired [by God] and yet we haven’t even carried it forth for even a couple of days. Shame on us.”

Bundy expressed frustration because his followers hadn’t been able to deter the BLM “within an hour”—“as the revelation had prophesied.” When an hour had passed, Bundy reportedly got into his bulldozer and decided to march on the BLM himself. His dozer got stuck in the mud—and that led to Bundy’s receiving yet another revelation: “It come to my mind real plain — the good Lord said, ‘Bundy, it’s not your job, it’s THEIR job.’” Bundy reiterated that revelation a little differently in an effort to ensure that his followers understood what he had just told them, “This is not my job, it’s YOUR job.”

Bundy said that he received a message that morning after he prayed. He claimed that he heard a voice say, “Sheriff Gillespie, your work is not done. Every sheriff across the United States, take the guns away from the United States bureaucrats.”

 Uncivil Disobedience

Even  The Weekly Standard–as well as Glenn Beck–has been critical of Cliven Bundy. The magazine’s Scrapbook explained the whole Bundy situation with regard to grazing fees and court rulings. The Scrapbook said that what had transpired over the years didn’t sound “like the dread hand of tyranny, in Nevada or Washington, oppressing an innocent farmer, or pushing some law-abiding citizen around.” It said it sounded, instead, “like a rancher gaming the system to his own financial advantage, and disguising his scheme in populist rhetoric: refusing to pay a tax which others must pay, and ‘tying up the courts’—for two decades!—as he continues to ignore the law.”

The Weekly Standard:

Far from acting in an arbitrary or capricious manner, the federal government has shown patience and forbearance in the face of lawlessness that customarily lands people in jail. It is worth noting that Bundy’s rancher-neighbors and the Nevada Cattlemen’s Association, who contend with the same federal policies, offer him little support.
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Frank Mortimer

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Re: Right Wing Republican Racists
« Reply #37 on: April 30, 2014, 01:51:52 AM »
Members of the Bundy Brigade Speak Out

Enders spoke to a militia member named Mark who was affiliated with the Oath Keepers group. Mark explained to her “the truth behind public land management.” He said, “The assumption is that the BLM is part of the federal government. But we need to check the facts on that one. The BLM doesn’t work for the government: they work for the United Nations. They might as well be wearing blue helmets. If we find out there’s money being exchanged between Harry Reid and the Chinese government, no one should be surprised.”


Well, I guess I'll weigh in. It doesn't take this reporter asking questions for Christians to see that a good portion of these people are backwoods conspiracy nuts, or that Bundy is racist.


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Even  The Weekly Standard–as well as Glenn Beck–has been critical of Cliven Bundy. The magazine’s Scrapbook explained the whole Bundy situation with regard to grazing fees and court rulings. The Scrapbook said that what had transpired over the years didn’t sound “like the dread hand of tyranny, in Nevada or Washington, oppressing an innocent farmer, or pushing some law-abiding citizen around.” It said it sounded, instead, “like a rancher gaming the system to his own financial advantage, and disguising his scheme in populist rhetoric: refusing to pay a tax which others must pay, and ‘tying up the courts’—for two decades!—as he continues to ignore the law.”


That is the bottom line that cannot be defended by any Christian. It's foolish to attempt to defend this man, or the band of people he has following him. Simply foolish.

 Proverbs 17:27-28
 "He that hath knowledge spareth his words: and a man of understanding is of an excellent spirit. Even a fool, when he holdeth his peace, is counted wise: and he that shutteth his lips is esteemed a man of understanding".


It's my view that faithful Christians need to steer clear of this extremism and concentrate on the great commission. Reformer has the right idea.


Rose

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Re: Right Wing Republican Racists
« Reply #38 on: April 30, 2014, 03:47:13 AM »
Far from acting in an arbitrary or capricious manner, the federal government has shown patience and forbearance in the face of lawlessness that customarily lands people in jail. It is worth noting that Bundy’s rancher-neighbors and the Nevada Cattlemen’s Association, who contend with the same federal policies, offer him little support.

 &TY That's what I thought. As opposed to what other administrations would have done, I think the federal government has shown remarkable patience and forbearance with these lawbreakers. Especially with them showing up with guns threatening violence. And for these underpaid agents who put their lives on the line for this country  to be called terrorists by John is a slap in the face of those who fight against real terrorists, not imagined ones. In my view, the administration has shown way too much patience with Bundy, and that's why its dragged on for so long. You give these people an inch and they take a mile. Everyone has to be accountable to the same laws. And Bundy is no exception.

 
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Jason

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Re: Right Wing Republican Racists
« Reply #39 on: April 30, 2014, 09:07:08 AM »

I'll buy that for a Dollar!

Brian

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Re: Right Wing Republican Racists
« Reply #40 on: April 30, 2014, 10:10:36 AM »
show me how the rancher was bigoted? A bigot is someone who is intolerant of any ideas other than his or her own, esp. on religion, politics, or race. How was the rancher intolerant? Again, like calling him a racist (racist: a person who believes certain groups are superior to others), what is your evidence? Racially insensitive, a stupid remark, ignorant, yes without a doubt - but racist and bigoted? No one has even started to prove that.

john

John,
   I think you touched a nerve here. Just ignorant? Racism is a refuge for a person's ignorance, as ignorance has to have an abode. This Rancher is not simply ignorant. Just because he is unaware of his bigotry doesn't mean he is not racist. 80 percent of the KKK will tell you that they are not racist, they just believe in the purity of white race. You know as well as I do that very few racists will say that they are racists. So in your book, I guess that means racism doesn't exist.


Philly Dawg

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Re: Right Wing Republican Racists
« Reply #41 on: April 30, 2014, 12:01:06 PM »
Freedom of Speech is Guaranteed, but it Has its Price!
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Colleen

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Re: Right Wing Republican Racists
« Reply #42 on: April 30, 2014, 06:06:18 PM »
As a black woman myself, I can say without fear of contradiction by any enabler or justifier that both the comments of Republicans Cliven Bundy and Donald Sterling were blatantly Racist, and anyone defending them are Racist also. Whether in the closet or out, whether they know it or not, whether its subconscious or not, it makes no difference to me. It really isn't very hard to tell when someone feels resentment against other races. You don't need a Ph.D.

 :iagree: This is true. It comes across in what they say, their one sided biased views, their inability to see the other point of view and their blogs and posts. I always put myself in the position of the other person, and usually that helps me to be fair. I know that you being a black woman, you come from the perspective of being the object of this bigotry, and that certainly cannot be discounted anymore than Republicans being the object of bias might be. I don't know why some people can't see that, but  I can only surmise it is resentment.

We have to deal with people individually, not as a whole race of people or ethnicity like Cliven Bundy did. Yes, that's Racism.  I also have a problem with so many generalizations about Republicans, Democrats Jews or Federal agents for that matter. Or seemingly blaming Cliven Bundy's Racism on Liberals or on Republicans. Joe Biden didn't make Bundy a racist, he did that all on his own. Nor does John Sterling buying off the NAACP with money and thus receiving an award from them mean that he is not a Racist either. It just means that group cares more about money than integrity, since it is common knowledge that John Sterling is a bigot. I notice on the news they are now scrambling because of a black backlash and surprise as much as the Republicans did when Bundy was outed. So it goes both ways. But you just keep up the good work. And don't worry, I'm not going to say you are a credit to your race or some other bigoted comment. :)

God Bless.


Lieberman

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Re: Right Wing Republican Racists
« Reply #43 on: May 01, 2014, 03:12:39 AM »
 :Question_: How does a rally against the BLM (Bureau of Land Management) even get to this vast generalization of black people anyway? What does black people have to do with his fight to have his cattle graze for free on government land? John would have us believe that this is the real issue, but even some conservatives say that he doesn't really have a legal leg to stand on. He's claiming some special right to let his cattle graze on federal land for free, not really that the land is his. Clearly this man has a racist agenda against blacks being lazy and better off picking cotton. Those are his words, not mine. I watched the Fox news broadcast and nearly everyone of them said that his comments were clearly Racist. But John continues to claim they are not as if he's lost touch with reality. I'd hate to think it was anything more than that. This man Bundy is more than a mere racist, he's also using this issue of BLM to put forth a deeper Racist agenda of putting all black people in the same box he has constructed. Talking about black people aborting their children (as if white people don't have abortions) and picking cotton. What is wrong with this man? He's more than just old and senile, he's a dinosaur better off extinct.


Lieberman

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Re: Right Wing Republican Racists
« Reply #44 on: May 01, 2014, 03:33:48 AM »

John,
   I think you touched a nerve here. Just ignorant? Racism is a refuge for a person's ignorance, as ignorance has to have an abode. This Rancher is not simply ignorant.

I think John touched a nerve with Christians because most people (not counting some pockets in southern areas) hate racism with a passion. Because it is so diabolically unchristian and wicked. It goes right to the core of natural man, to the beast in him. We can hate welfare, abortions, liberal policies, government intrusions, etc., without being racist or supporting rebellion or half-crazed militia. But apparently, many other people cannot keep the two things separate. They tie the two together because they need a scape goat, are selfish and bigoted by nature, and can hide their true nature from some behind labels like Patriot and Conservative.

This is exactly the same as the Nazi did with the Jews. Blamed the failing economy on the Jews, appealed to German nationalism and Patriotism and blamed their lot in life on the Jews. We know what was the outcome of that. As Tony always says, nothing changes. People just repeat the same sins over and over again.  As Conservative Christians, we cannot allow ourselves to be drawn into communion with the likes of Bundy and his band of rebels. We have to be above that sort of thing. Christians by definition have a different nature. It's why as a Jew I am a Christian and not with my physical heritage. It's because Christians have a different nature than the Physical Jews, than Bundy and than the Militia. And if we don't, we need to ask ourselves why.

I think this is my last post on this subject, as I think I've said all I need to say and you all can make up your own minds about what is Christian and what is not, what is racism and what is not, and what is Christlike and what is not.

 :word:

 


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