[ Home | Eschatology | Bible Studies | Classics | Articles | Sermons | Apologetics | Search | F.A.Q. ]

Author Topic: Bart Ehrman  (Read 490 times)

da525382

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 158
  • Obviously I'm a Novice
Bart Ehrman
« on: April 12, 2018, 07:15:27 PM »
Hello, I haven't been here for awhile.  I was just wondering if anyone knows any critical historians who are non-theists who nonetheless disagree with Bart Ehrman's conclusions about Christianity?  I have found criticisms of Ehrman from theologians, etc., but those who follow Ehrman reject them as non-credible due to their theistic bias.  Anyway, if there are any websites you could point me to, I would appreciate it.

Reformed Baptist

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 255
  • Reformed Baptists
Re: Bart Ehrman
« Reply #1 on: April 13, 2018, 01:45:27 AM »
 )S_Confused( Who is Bart Ehrman?

Mila Ostrovsky

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 78
  • Gender: Female
  • Obviously I'm a Novice
Re: Bart Ehrman
« Reply #2 on: April 13, 2018, 05:21:26 AM »
Bart D. Ehrman
American scholar
bartdehrman.com

Bart Denton Ehrman is an American New Testament scholar focusing on textual criticism of the New Testament, the historical Jesus, and the development of early Christianity. He has written and edited 30 books, including three college textbooks.
-Wikipedia

Born: October 5, 1955 (age 62 years), Lawrence, KS
Nationality: American
Spouse: Sarah Beckwith
Education: Princeton Theological Seminary (1985), Princeton Theological Seminary, Moody Bible Institute, Wheaton College
Children: Derek Ehrman, Kelly Ehrman

All you need to know is that he went to Prinston Theological, a very "VERY" liberal and often unbiblical Seninary.  :(

Even though it didn't start out that way, it apostatized.

Kenneth White

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 307
  • Gender: Male
  • Thinking Christians, Intelligent Theology
Re: Bart Ehrman
« Reply #3 on: April 13, 2018, 08:10:46 AM »
I view  Bart Ehrman as a rather liberal theologian that is in essence attacking the inspiration, infallibility and integrity of the Holy Scriptures without a firm foundation for doing so. When I read his writings I get the impression that he has a very bleak picture of scribal activity in penning the Bible. I've read him extensively and throughout his writings I believe that he often clandestinely injects his own viewpoints, rather than drawing from a unbiased and scholarly examination of the texts he's examining. Often by his subjective and often jaundiced selection of material.  Ehrman's background is evangelical and his time at Moody Bible Institute, and at Wheaton College belies his appearance of objectivity. In short, I have found that you do not get a unbiased and objective view when you read Ehrman.
   
Proverbs 1:5-6 "A wise man will hear, and will increase learning; and a man of understanding shall attain unto wise counsels: To understand a proverb, and the interpretation; the words of the wise, and their dark sayings."

da525382

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 158
  • Obviously I'm a Novice
Re: Bart Ehrman
« Reply #4 on: April 13, 2018, 08:47:36 PM »
Thanks everyone for the responses.  I post a lot on another board and this ex-Christian Ehrman devotee is always ranting on about his newfound agnosticism/atheism (you can see a lot of Ehrman's videos on YouTube).  The problem with discussing anything with him is that he will not accept any Christian historian's or Christian apologist's analysis, stating they are completely untrustworthy.  The only counter arguments he will accept must be from secular, critical historians.  I guess that's safe because that very small segment of historians would tend to agree with Ehrman.  So, I was trying to find some secular historian who opposes Ehrman's theses.  Thanks all.

James Heckman

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 93
Re: Bart Ehrman
« Reply #5 on: April 15, 2018, 05:59:05 AM »

Public Debate With Bart Ehrman in Seminaries: A Bad Decision

https://www.thebereancall.org/content/public-debate-bart-ehrman-seminaries-bad-decision

Reformer

  • Affiliate Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 1646
  • Reformed and Evangelical
Re: Bart Ehrman
« Reply #6 on: April 15, 2018, 08:03:17 AM »
Speaking of which:

Jim Elliff says, Avoid Bart Ehrman, He Could Cause You To Lose Your Faith!

https://brucegerencser.net/2015/11/jim-elliff-says-avoid-bart-ehrman-he-could-cause-you-to-lose-your-faith/

Now I don't know about losing your faith, because real faith cannot be lost, but I do agree in principle because such faithlessness masquerading as scholarship will deceive the weak and novices in Christ. Scripture confirms it.

Ro 16:17 Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them."
18 For they that are such serve not our Lord Jesus Christ, but their own belly; and by good words and fair speeches deceive the hearts of the simple.



tony e

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 27
  • Obviously I'm a Novice
Re: Bart Ehrman
« Reply #7 on: April 15, 2018, 05:46:23 PM »
James white and Daniel Wallace have both debated him. Videos can be found on YouTube. I watched them a few years ago

Big Ben

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 34
  • Gender: Male
  • Always Running The race
Re: Bart Ehrman
« Reply #8 on: April 16, 2018, 03:02:53 AM »
If he's not a Christian, and he is not, then why do Christians care so much about what he says? A hundred anti Christian writers have attacked Christianity but we're not making them famous by posting about and debating them. Ignore him and he'll go away. Debate him and he gains clout. Is it because he is a former Christian that makes Christians want to debate and correct him? Aren't we supposed to shake the dust of our shoes off as a testimony against him.

aquatic

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 215
  • Gender: Male
Re: Bart Ehrman
« Reply #9 on: April 22, 2018, 12:20:43 AM »
Big Ben you are correct. Some of the best advice I’ve seen here stated: We are witnesses. Not debaters. We can’t convince or argue with people.

Reformer

  • Affiliate Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 1646
  • Reformed and Evangelical
Re: Bart Ehrman
« Reply #10 on: April 22, 2018, 06:33:35 AM »
I agree with Big Ben fully, and with aquatic partly (I think). I agree we aren't to give this man clout and make him famous by giving him a larger forum to spout his heresy among Christians. James white not withstanding.

Mt 7:6 Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you.

If that was written for anyone, it was written for people like this man who has turned against Christianity. A former Christian even more since he has 7 more devils than before having returned again to his god.

2Pe 2:22 But it is happened unto them according to the true proverb, The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire.

I agree with aquatic partly because we are witnesses, and I agree we aren't to debate  swine/sows in the Biblical way of putting it, but I don't agree we are not to debate. If aquatic meant we aren't to debate swine, we are in agreement. If aquatic meant we aren't to debate period, I don't agree with that. Debating is a fundamental part of witnessing. The dictionary defines debate as a mutual discussion on any particular topic, or to have a dialog or talk over/through a subject. To hash out a problem. Christ did that, we do that, the apostle Paul did that. Nothing wrong with honest debate. It's when the other person tramples the word under foot that we are to leave off from debating them. So in that sense we are witnesses and debaters.

Reformer

  • Affiliate Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 1646
  • Reformed and Evangelical
Re: Bart Ehrman
« Reply #11 on: April 22, 2018, 07:54:43 AM »
James white and Daniel Wallace have both debated him.

James white and Daniel Wallace have contributed to making Bart Ehrman the draw to Christians that he has become.

R. Anspach

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 47
  • Gender: Male
  • No condemnation for those who are in Christ
Re: Bart Ehrman
« Reply #12 on: April 23, 2018, 06:23:48 AM »
James white and Daniel Wallace have both debated him.

James white and Daniel Wallace have contributed to making Bart Ehrman the draw to Christians that he has become.

Romans 16
“17 Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them."
18 For they that are such serve not our Lord Jesus Christ, but their own belly; and by good words and fair speeches deceive the hearts of the simple.”

Has the word become meaningless to us these days? Debating an antichrist is never a good idea according to scripture. The Bible’s assessment of Bart Ehrman is that not only is he a false teacher but an antichrist:

I John 4
“1 Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.
2 Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God:
3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.”

Why is it that Christians have become too smart, too educated, too scholarly to listen to the scriptures anymore?  :-X
"But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith." Galatians 3:11

da525382

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 158
  • Obviously I'm a Novice
Re: Bart Ehrman
« Reply #13 on: May 07, 2018, 09:26:52 PM »
Thank you all.   I guess I have a tendency to become depressed when interacting with atheists/agnostics who dismiss all of the Bible as myth and unreliable "literary stories" per Ehrman.  They just see nothing but God vs science and since there is "no proof" (as Ehrman I guess has determined), then their belief goes out the door, with sort of a hostile view of faith as "non-science" and therefore "nonsense".  Especially when they had previously been believers for many years.  It's always been difficult for me to not only know what to say to them, but what to think as I move on.....But on the other side of the coin I have found that it really doesn't matter what I or anyone else says to these people who have made up their minds in this way, because the condescension that sets in is quite entrenched.

I have been posting on another Christian discussion board, but there are now so many of these people there who think this way (which appears to me to be in a proselytizing way), it is getting me down in my daily life and I think I need to go somewhere else to sort of "revive and renew".  I think perhaps its time to simply leave that board and come here perhaps, to a group of people (Reformed, such as myself) who seem to have a supportive role in serving intelligence, wisdom, and careful stewardship of the text (or go to other boards you all may suggest).  Yet, on the other hand, I feel like I'm giving up and maybe shouldn't.  But really I've sort of "screamed" my head off so to speak in trying to argue with everything I've got over at that board, but really, I don't know if there is much one can do in the presence of a seemingly entrenched spirit of unbelief, which merely demands "proof" before moving on with discussion, and really has no use for discussing much of anything else.

Tra Millwood

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 74
  • I'm a llama!
Re: Bart Ehrman
« Reply #14 on: May 08, 2018, 12:30:17 PM »
Thank you all.   I guess I have a tendency to become depressed when interacting with atheists/agnostics who dismiss all of the Bible as myth and unreliable "literary stories" per Ehrman.

Join the crowd, it's frustrating to faithful Christians, but that's the way the world is headed now, and many people in the Christians camp with it.

Rev. 14:12
Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

Patience is keeping the faith in the midst of these offences.


Quote
Especially when they had previously been believers for many years.  It's always been difficult for me to not only know what to say to them, but what to think as I move on....

Mark 4:16-17
And these are they likewise which are sown on stony ground; who, when they have heard the word, immediately receive it with gladness; And have no root in themselves, and so endure but for a time: afterward, when affliction or persecution ariseth for the word's sake, immediately they are offended.

It's to be expected.


Quote
I have been posting on another Christian discussion board, but there are now so many of these people there who think this way (which appears to me to be in a proselytizing way), it is getting me down in my daily life and I think I need to go somewhere else to sort of "revive and renew".

II Timothy 4:3-5
For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables. But watch thou in all things, endure afflictions, do the work of an evangelist, make full proof of thy ministry.


Quote
I think perhaps its time to simply leave that board and come here perhaps, to a group of people (Reformed, such as myself) who seem to have a supportive role in serving intelligence, wisdom, and careful stewardship of the text (or go to other boards you all may suggest).  Yet, on the other hand, I feel like I'm giving up and maybe shouldn't.

I understand, I've been in that situation myself. But at some point you have to ask yourself if you are just casting pearls before swine. If so, that is not giving up, that's moving on.


Quote
I don't know if there is much one can do in the presence of a seemingly entrenched spirit of unbelief, which merely demands "proof" before moving on with discussion, and really has no use for discussing much of anything else.

It seems the problem is not that they demand proof (I often demand proof myself), but from my experience the problem is, or will be, that no proof that you give them will ever satisfy them. They will always disagree that it is proof. At least that's been my experience.


 


[ Home | Eschatology | Bible Studies | Classics | Articles | Sermons | Apologetics | Search | F.A.Q. ]